Do you know what resolution you are printing at when you are printing with an image out of Elements? You should have a resolution of approximately 200ppi.
cnoel,
There are several things necessary to print well in Elements ( it is a color managed application, so it’s easy to screw up ! <G>)
1. Calibrate and profile your display using Adobe Gamma or another such utility. This is absolutely necessary if you expect your display to correctly interpret the data in your images. Tutorial at <
http://www.computer-darkroom.com/ps7-colour/ps7_2.htm> .
2. Size your image to an even resolution between 300 – 360 ppi ( this will give you plenty of pixels for printing, later you can see how few pixels you can send to the printer and still get acceptable results ) .
3. Work with Elements set to "limited color management " ( that is the sRGB colorspace that is being used by your printer when it prints directly from the camera ).
4. Use the "print preview" dialogue of Elements, setting Color Management on, the output profile space to "Printer Color Management", and your printer settings to the best mode and appropriate paper.
You should then be able to print effectively what you see on your display. That’s about the hardest thing to nail down . There are plenty of discussions on the subject, in general, at <
http://www.computer-darkroom.com/> and <
http://www.normankoren.com/makingfineprints4.html> , but none of them are specific to your printer.
Hope you have good results.
🙂
Brent
Brent,
Thanks for you help. I have a question about my resolution settings. After downloading the images from my s400 to Elements, how do I adjust my resolution to 300-360 ppi? Are you telling me that I can increase a images resolution to a higher setting then what the camera sets when the image is taken?
Chris
Do you know what resolution the printer is currently printing at? I just looked up your Canon CP-200 and see it’s one of those little guys that does a direct print of a 4 X 6. You’ll find that most of the regulars on the forum are still using standard size inkjets – especially me! I’ve been curious about how they size photos for printing and still don’t know.
Using my Canon S30 as an example (which does not do a direct print), my image files transfer from the camera as JPEGs. When I open them in Elements, I go to Image>Resize>Image Size, the display indicates a document size of almost 8 X 10, and the resolution is 180ppi. If I want to reduce that so I can print a 4 X 6, I have to increase the resolution to 330 ppi and then crop out a small amount of excess to get an exact size.
My guess is that your little printer is doing some resizing somewhere within its printing process, but it would interesting to find out.
How about downloading an image to your computer, checking the resolution and physical size, and then posting the specs that so we can see what you get when you use it that way? You’ve got me curious now! I’d like to know if resizing is going on within the printer or the camera, and I’m almost positive it’s within the printer. One of the regulars has a S400 which she uses with a standard printer, and if I remember right, her image files opened at about 180, too, just like mine.
Beth,
When I get home I will do a little test. I do know that my S400 settings are what Canon calls "Medium 1" (SuperFine) 1,002 KB @ 1,600 x 1,200. My CP-200 is printing 4" x 6" cards at 300 dpi.
Any ideas?
cp-200 info – <
http://www.powershot.com/powershot2/cp300-200/index.html>
Thanks
cnoel,
Is the entire image represented in the print, all of the scene as you framed it with camera, or does it appear that a small area along one dimension got "cropped" off??
Interesting. There’s a lot of conversion going on somewhere. And I, too, would be interestied in hearing how much difference there is between the print you get from a new image file directly from the camera compared to what you see on the monitor when you open the same image in Elements. Wow, Nancy, maybe we’ll learn something about this new fangled stuff?! 🙂
Beth,
Because of the image dimensions 1600×1200 and he gets 4×6 at 300…well you see where I was coming from…that would be 1200×1800
Nancy,
No the entire image is not represented.
When printing directly to the CP-200 printer the Camera has a small display telling you what area is going to print. There is a small amount that is cropped on all sides in order to print a 4"x6". The actual paper that is used by the printer is larger than 4"x6". Both sides of the paper have a perforated edge you tear off. The printer prints about 1/8 of a inch to the outside of that edge. You then tear off the ends to get the borderless image.
Thanks
Chris
cnoel,
The math told me cropping was occuring and I thank you for expounding on the process. I have not know anyone who had one of these printers.
Is the frame used for cropping movable within the camera display?
Nancy,
I believe the frame can be moved. The frame can also be resized to a selected area in the photo. I have not played around with that feature.
Chris
Ah ha. Ain’t this new fangled technology great? I’m glad you showed up here, Chris. I’m not ready to get one of those small printers, but I like having the chance to understand how they work.
In response to your question a few posts back, you might want to do some experimenting in Elements with increasing the resolution and then print and see if you can tell any difference. I don’t think you will. The target printing range for inkjets is 150 – 300ppi, and most people can’t tell any difference in quality by going above 300. I often print at 330, just so I don’t have to fiddle with resampling, but the prints are no better than at 300. The larger file size you’re getting would let you print an 8 X 10, for example, at a higher resolution than what I can manage. Obviously, in order to do that, though, you’d have to have another printer in addition to your CP-200.
Nancy, I believe the answer to your question re a movable cropping box within the camera is "Yes". I’ve seen it done using the Canon s230 with the DP200 printer.
Chuck
Beth,
I am not sure if it makes a difference, but you stated that "The target printing range for inkjets is 150 – 300ppi". The CP-200 is not a inkjet it is a Dye-Sublimation printer.
Here is the info on the print process.
<
http://www.powershot.com/powershot2/cp300-200/features3.html>
Does your statement apply to Dye-Sublimation printers?
I am sure you already know this, but I am new to printing.
Chris
Cnoel- I don’t believe your question about how to adjust resolution in elements was answered (well except mathamatically-which goes way over my head…no don’t try to explain). Go to image menu and select resize option. You will be able to change resolution here. You will also be able to see how large you can successfully print your image in this dialog box. I use this instead of doing math. I would uncheck resampling. It’s one of those deals that could potentially create problems with picture quality. If someone actually answered this before, sorry all I can plead is I was blinded by the math talk which made my eyes water and my head swim.
Chris, there are a couple of people on the forum who have dye-sub printers, but if they’re using different standards for the target range for resolution I haven’t been paying enough attention to have picked up on it! I suspect one of them will be along shortly to give us both a better idea of the differences if there are any that are significant. I guess this is something I should be boning up on, but I hadn’t really given it much thought until you brought it up!
Because that CP-200 is showing a resolution of 300ppi, my gut is telling me that the target resolution for the image itself is much the same, but the biggest difference between traditional inkjets and the dye-sub is the way in which the ink is put down on the photo paper. Well, the ink itself would be different, too, but there’s also a variation in inks between brands of inkjets.
The image resolution is referring to the number of pixels per inch, which is definitely a different ballgame from the old "dpi" measurement of printer resolution. Have you ever worked with drawings on graph paper? You know how if you do identical drawings on paper with a size of four boxes per inch you get a much smaller picture than if you do the same drawing on paper with two boxes per inch? That’s the way pixels work, only you’re dealing with a heck of a lot more little boxes per inch!
This is interesting. I’m waiting for somebody else to weigh in with more information.
Beth,
I had a dye sub about 5 years ago, and it specified a 300 ppi image for best results. Don’t know, of course, if that is standard for the species <G> .
🙂
If someone has Richard Lynch’s book handy, you might want to check there. He has a number of resolution rules for various types of printers, and dye-sub may be one of them. (My copy is about 1000 miles away at the moment….)
Chuck
Well I have Richard’s book handy, but either I’m index-challenged or there’s nothing in there about dye-subs. I’d say it’s 50/50 which way that might go. All I find are references to lasers versus inkjet. If anybody finds it, please let me know. I did find some resolution rules, though, and "inkjet printing" is listed in the index, if that redeems me any. 🙂
FWIW, 300 ppi is standard throughout the printing industry. Pretty nearly every glam pic you’ve ever seen in any book or magazine was done from a 300 ppi file.
The Image Setter does a lot to make it look better than your home printer does (that’s where you get into line screens and such), but just like your inkjet or home dye-sub, it doesn’t need more than that to work its magic.
Thanks for the help. I hope I can get things to work.
Barb, thanks for that info on 300 ppi. Glad to know I’ve been giving the right advice…despite those comments that were made to me here about 8 weeks ago…….I wont mention any names and have not seen this person here in quite some time….but he had mentioned that 300 was not the best way to go and he went on explaning himself with a pile of other posts that frankly were too long for me to have the patience to read…or want to read is more like it. Anyways, thanks.
Ok, this is what I found.
When opening a file from my S400 the image is 1600×1200 (8.89"x 6.67") @ 180-ppi. If I increase the resolution to 360-ppi does that increase my resolution for printing? If so is 360-ppi the highest I can go?
Important question – If Elements opens images up at 180-ppi, is that what the flies are on my camera? The reason I ask is because my CP-200 printer prints at 300-ppi. Are my pictures printing at 180-ppi from my camera? Am I taking full advantage of this printer?????
ARRRRRGGGG!
Cnoel,
The important part is that your image is 1600×1200, don’t worry about dpi/ppi until it is actually time to print (that’s the only time it counts, is when it’s going on paper). I’d say that, because you are printing directly from the camera to the printer, that all of the pixels available are being used. If you’ve selected the maximum area in the camera, then you’ll get maximum resolution on the printer.
When you bring an image into PSE2, it reads the EXIF data and I believe that Canon defaults to 180-ppi in the EXIF, just so they can give you an idea of what size image you’ll get at a reasonable resolution.
When you’ve done all of your adjustments, red eye, remove the telephone pole from someone’s head, etc. etc. THEN, and only then, do you worry about dpi/ppi.
The first thing you do is decide how big a print you want to make. If you’re after a 4"x 6" image to mail off to someone, then you’ll find that you’ll have to crop to get 1200 pixels by 1600 pixels to come out evenly. After you’ve done your crop, divide the number of vertical pixels by the number of vertical inches you want to print at. If the number comes out in the 300 dpi/ppi area, you’re golden – print it. If it comes out way low, say 120 dpi/ppi then you may want to use PSE2 to resize the image – however – be aware that this will generate pixels that aren’t currently there so some softening of edges etc. may become apparent. If it comes out way high (i.e.: 700 dpi/ppi) don’t worry about it, the printer will use what it can.
If you’re after an 8" x 10" portrait you may have to resize, as you’re going to wind up in the 160 to 180 dpi range, but print a test and have a look, it may be OK. I do 8"x10" from my Canon A40 (which also gives me 1600×1200 jpegs) to a Epson C80 (inkjet), using heavy weight matte paper. They’re not gallery quality, but they look fine for my needs.
And remember, it’s only confusing at the beginning, a month from now you’ll wonder what all the fuss was! 😉
oh… yeah…. hang around this forum, there’s all sorts of folks who’ll be happy to help!
HTH
Kyle
cnoel,
Wayne Fulton’s excellent site gives a good foundation for working with digital images. He explains in a very clear manner the concept of image resolution, pixels and what one needs to understand for digital imagery. Have a good read at his site, you will leave there with a great education on this subject.
<
http://scantips.com>
Now, your questions…which you will find the answers to on his site, but to give it a short go…
Files from digital cameras are all 72ppi. The ppi number is only relative to printing and has no bearing on screen viewing as monitors don’t relate to ppi. An image is really only a grid comprised of "x" pixels by "y" pixels. The higher the megapixel the camera, the more pixels in the image. One particular camera produces files of certain dimensions, in your case 1600×1200. This is an absolute (at the quality you have the camera set for). What is variable, is the degree of compactness of these finite pixels. The level of compression can merely be assigned in an arbitrary manner. The more tightly packed together these pixels are, the less physical space they occupy when printing.
A file at 72 ppi has rather large pixels and won’t produce a nice print as they will be noticable and the photo will not be sharp nor pleasing. I can assign a more appropriate ppi to said file if I want to get a decent print. With the pixels smaller, the detail in the image is much better and the tones seem continuous, rather than looking like little boxes as they would at 72ppi. The number of pixels remains the same, I only change their spacing, I crowd them together, I change the resolution. Between 180-300ppi is a good resolution for a file you wish to print. However, the higher the resolution, the smaller the printed size will be (they are crowded and take up less space). Resolution and printed size are inversely proportional.
So…your camera produces files at 72ppi, Elements presents them to you at 180ppi. Probably because you can print at this resolution (albeit the lower end of generally accepted printing res.). It has the same number of pixels the camera produced. If you take your pics in jpg format and open using Explorer, they will have a res. of 72ppi. It really doesn’t matter. I can change the res. of an image all day long and not harm the picture (as long as Resample is not used). Your printer is changing the res. of the images to 300ppi for good quality printing, undoubtedly from the incamera res. of 72 to 300. When opened in Elements at 180ppi, you could change that to a higher number for better quality in printing, such as 300. Sometimes images look fine when printed having a res. of 180ppi. Sometimes it is a trade off, you go with the 180 res. because you want the printout to be larger than you would get with 300ppi.
There is no point in assigning a res. over 300ppi. No advantage, no gain. At 300ppi, you will get the maximum quality you can get.
Nancy
edit—you were typing as was I, I wrote this before you posted, sorry.
WOW!
Thanks to everyone for your help! This is truly a great place for information..
Am I right in saying I can get a much sharper image printing from Photoshop or Elements?
Chris
Chris, we don’t want to make any false claims here…! The sharpness of your image will be dependent on several factors, the most important of which are the focus of your camera and your ability to keep camera shake to a minimum. If the image is out of focus, Elements can’t do much. Now, if you bring a well-focused picture into Elements, you can enhance its apparent sharpness using the Sharpen tools in the Filter menu. The most-used tool has the confusing name of Unsharp Mask, but it’s the most flexible way to sharpen your images.
