Very strange behavior of Photoshop: when I print a photo in Photoshop with my HP 1210 printer, I get a very poor result (very, very dark picture). The same file, printed with a different program (even the most simple) gives excellent results. Now, since Photoshop is practically not usable with my printer, what I have to do is to edit the photo file in Photoshop, and THEN print it with a different program!!! Not very practical indeed! Am I missing something? Any suggestion would be appreciated.
What you’re witnessing is what happens when you use a color-managed application (Elements or full Photoshop) with a monitor that hasn’t been properly calibrated. Adobe packages Adobe Gamma with Elements for this purpose, and it may have installed on your computer when you loaded Elements (you don’t give any platform or OS information) or you can find it on the install CD.
Here’s an excellent site with information about color management, and it also gives good instructions for monitor calibration.
Luciano, I can empathize. I have gone through the Adobe Gamma calibration (5 times!) and still am having poor results. I have even downloaded the "Ignore EXIF colorspace meta data" plug in from Adobe but it hasn’t helped either.
I am getting prints that match my "calibrated" LCD with the Canon software that came with my camera; but it’s editing capabilities are very limited.
Michael, please give us more information about the platform you’re using, the operating system, and the monitor. Adobe Gamma isn’t designed to use with LCDs, but I think some people have been able to do manual adjustments. Hopefully one of them can give you some advice. I think if you use a Mac it’s a little easier, but maybe I’m just dreaming about that part.
Michael, same thing here. Calibrated my LCD Sony several times, wasted tons of paper and ink, but still the quality of prints is awful. Must use the simple tool that came with my camera (Canon) to get good results. Oh, well…..
I use an HP PhotoSmart 7150, which I think is just a newer, cheaper (not just less expensive) rendition of the printer you are using. When I calibrated my LCD monitor, I followed all the instructions EXCEPT for adjusting the contrast to the maximum. That really messed up my calibration. I set the contrast to what looked good to my eye, and then went ahead and finished the calibration process. I had to go back and make it a couple of minor adjustments, but my prints really match my display quite well now. And so do the prints that I have done by a photo lab.
A useful tidbit I picked up at the Retouchpro site might be helpful to assess your calibration after you begin editing images…
* create a new document, the usual resolution of your images * make it just a small band, of a size which can ride over a small portion of typical image * drag out a lengthwise rectangle with marquee * with black as foreground color, select linear black to white gradient and drag exactly left to right edge * in Layers Palette, choose a Posterization, 21 steps (or you can use less) * save this file on desktop, or some easily located file * whenever beginning an edit, open that step wedge, drag a copy over to your image * now you can get a better idea of what’s happening as you make edits * just delete the layer when finished your edit
I’ve just spent the better part of two hours setting up a new LCD and TRYING to get it calibrated. Boy, I can hardly wait until I can switch to dual monitors and get back to using the CRT for editing! 🙂 And, yes, I did carefully follow the instructions on Ian Lyons’ site for calibrating an LCD under OS X. I’m calibration-challenged I guess. I now have more sympathy for those who are having trouble getting a good match between what they see on the screen and what they get from the printer. However, I’ve just done a successful demonstration (to myself) of how much the calibration of the monitor really does effect the way colors in a picture come out. I’m lucky, though; I can always disconnect this gorgeous new LCD and go back to using the CRT. I feel sorry for you who have to "wing it" through this process. 🙁
I haven’t tried Nancy’s suggestion yet. I have to rest my eyes and my nerves first.
Obviously not as good as I should have been, because he brought it uncalibrated! 🙂 When I do the comparison between what I printed after editing on the CRT and what I’m getting from the LCD on the same image, it looks like blue that’s off. Oh, my. This obviously needs more study.
OK, I’m very confused now. What the hell has to do the calibration of my LCD with the quality of the print? Why is that the same file is printed differently if the ‘print’ command is launched from Photoshop or from a different sw? Why is that the file looks fine on the LCD screen, and awful when printed with program ‘A?, and fine again when printed with program ‘B’???
Elements is undoubtedly the only color managed application you have installed on your computer, which is why you’re seeing the unacceptable colors when printing from it. I’m definitely NOT the person to explain the concept to you, but this is a link to the section on color management and monitor calibration for Photoshop 7 on Ian Lyons’ Computer Darkroom site. Everything he says will apply to Elements, because it runs on the PS 7.0 engine. Ian explains color management in the opening paragraphs.
The difference in the technology between CRT and LCD monitors makes the LCDs harder to calibrate (as you can see from my experience of today!) A large number of graphics arts professionals continue to use CRTs for their work, because it’s still relatively easy to set them up right. Given the number of people upgrading to LCDs, we can hope that somebody soon will come up with a way to get them calibrated that’s less expensive than the options that are available now. To do an exact job requires hardware, and that’s still running several hundred dollars. 🙁
The display on that new LCD of mine is gorgeous, but it’s going to get "retired" from photo editing real soon if a couple more tweaks don’t resolve the color issues. I’ve recently gotten Photoshop CS, too, and, of course, I now have color problems with it as well. (Santa, bless his heart, did forget to ask if I wanted an LCD!)
Good luck! But you’re experiencing the downside of using a full bodied digital image editing application and a cool, modern monitor.
Beth, ya know, I’m a little worried. I plan on upgrading to a new computer at some point but not within the next year. Ya think I’ll still be able to find a good CRT by then…perhaps a flatscreen CRT ? I’m a little disapointed at what is available at the moment in flat CRT’s for ‘photoshop’ happy people such as myself. I really don’t want to get an LCD if calibration is a problem. I am very well spoiled with my current monitor as far as color perfection and ease of calibration…but it’s only a 15" ( more like 13" viewing area ). Staples carries a 17" flat CRT…same brand that I am currently using with same coloreal technology. I’m tempted but then again…I just don’t know. I wish i had a crystal ball.
My crystal ball tells me that by the time you will buy your new computer, LCD calibration will not be a problem anymore. Manufacturers are already aware of the problem and working on it. Also, it’s predicted that sales of LCD screen will outgrow those of CRT this year. And when a new technology gets attention from the mass, problems are usually solved rapidly.
You might as well consider a dual monitor system. An LCD for the tools, a CRT for the pictures.
Ray, yes I hope your crystal ball is right. From what I’ve seen through in-store comparison the SONY flat LCD’s seems to have an overall better picture…I may go that route although I’m not sure I want a SONY PC>>>>what do you think about that ?
FYI I have a Sony Vaio with a 17" Sony SDM-HS73 LCD monitor. I am printing with a Canon i950. Camera is a Canon 10D.
To be more specific, I was able to "calibrate" my monitor using some test prints I downloaded from Norman Koren’s website. However, these files are jpeg’s without EXIF data. I was suspicious of Adobe Gamma’s usefulness with an LCD simply because of the terminology. For instance, it asks what phosphors the display is using and an LCD doesn’t have them. The process is also complicated by the fact that LCDs have a backlight control in addition to brightness that I can’t find reference to on any article/website regarding calibration.
The problem I am having is with pictures taken with my 10D. I download them into my computer with either "File Utility Viewer" or "ZoomBrowser" (both supplied by Canon)and then open them up in Elements 2.0 (also came with the camera) for editing. The pictures are very dark and colors are somewhat off (not bad though). The pictures I print from Elements 2.0 look fine, just nothing like the monitor shows (the are much brighter and a bit less red). This makes it very hard to do any type of quality editing.
Today is my day of searching for help. I just called Canon, they were friendly but not helpful. Next, I going to call/email Sony and Adobe.
When I shoped for my LCD screen, Sony were top on my list. Only their prices were over the top of my list 😉 Viewsonic were nice as well (obviously, since I got one!) Rick has a Viewsonic as well, but a CRT. Trully, I prefer mine over his. Samsung had nice unit as well.
I’d stay away from Sony computers. Every time I hear something about Sony computers, it’s bad. Sorry for those whom got one, but that’s the truth. Photoshop Album has problems, and in a recent consumer magazine, they recalled several of their laptops because of a risk of fire. For the time being, you’d be better choosing something else.
Sidecar, I think we have gotten away from answering your orginal question. Sorry.
I am no expert, but perhaps the other software you are using to print (the ones giving good results) are working because they automatically default to your printer’s driver for color management.
Elements, however, can default to the printer or add a color profile on its own. It’s possible that Elements is trying to control the color and is using the wrong profile.
The latest edition of Digital Camera magazine (Volume 6, Number 30) has an article on printing. If you are using the paper an inks suppled by the printer manufacturer then let the printer handle its own color management. To do this select "print preview" from the file menu. Then, check the box "Show More Options". Under Print Space, make sure the profile says "Same as Source" or "Printer Color Management". This will take Adobe out of the color management loop.
Sony makes great monitors, but, like Ray, I haven’t heard many good stories about their computers. Maybe they wandered too far afield from what they are best at – devices that display images?
I’m going to keep fiddling with my LCD for a while, for just because it’s here. I clearly won’t be trying to use it for digital editing until somebody comes up with a more efficient way to calibrate than what’s currently available. I probably got as close as I did because I run it from a Mac. Ian Lyons has quite a bit of good information on his site about calibrating an LCD under OS X, but he’s quick to point out that it might be only marginally useful to non-Mac users. And, Adobe Gamma certainly isn’t designed to be used with LCDs.
Jodi, I’d suggest you replace your monitor when you want, with what you want. There’s certainly no reason to have monitors and computers systems that "match". During the next year or so, before you’re actually ready to buy a new computer system, will give you a lot of time to research. For the kind of work you’re doing, you may decide you don’t even want to stay with a Win system. You just never know! 🙂
I was to buy an LCD calibration tool this morning, but the store I went to are not carrying Colorvision Spyder anymore. They offered some much more expensive brand instead. I will check for an online merchant in Canada. Already have one but I’d like to compare prices. In any case, I’ll let you know how it works once it’s here 🙂
Some digital cameras incorrectly indicate color space, in their EXIF tags. This causes PSE to display them incorrectly. The utility allows you to… ignore EXIF where color space is concerned.
The utility is available for download on the Adobe web site, under the support area.
I mention it in the event you have not yet ruled it out as a source of trouble.
I followed your tip, selected the ‘Same as source’ in the Print Space and….. the print is now – I would say – PERFECT (as shown on the LCD monitor).
Now I need to study, and following Beth link I want to understand a bit more of the magic of ‘color management’. But I am glad that now the problem with Elements is solved.
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