Getting flesh colors right?

DM
Posted By
Duncan McBride
May 14, 2005
Views
334
Replies
14
Status
Closed
I have been using PSE since just before version 3 came out, and I have found invaluable help from other peoples’ posts on this forum as I have been learning. Thanks! I’m using PSE3 now, need help, and have not seen this topic covered.

I think my problem is both artistic and technical: Sometimes I can’t get Caucasian flesh colors right. I usually, but not always, do all right with photos taken in natural light, but artificial light, especially fluorescent light, is a problem. The flesh colors tend to a yellow-brown or a red-brown, depending on how high I crank the red saturation. I have been taking lots of candid portraits at small professional meetings, which are usually in windowless conference rooms lit by fluorescent lights, so this is a problem. I know fluorescent light is difficult, but I think I can do better.

To work on this I have used the eyedropper to copy some flesh colors, both good and defective, to large adjacent areas on a blank white background and tried to adjust them in isolation to see what works, and even there I am having trouble getting good matches.

Flesh colors vary, but I think our eye is especially sensitive to off color here, and I am particular about it. Other colors in the images are acceptable, so it’s not just a color cast. Does anyone have advice on this? Or know of a good reference?

See below for some details of what I am doing that might matter. ————————-
I am shooting RAW, opening with ACR in PSE3, adjusting white balance to get whites and greys correct (usually custom), making other ACR adjustments, converting to 16-bit .psd files, making adjustments I can there – Hue/Saturation, minor Levels adjustments, cropping – and then doing any selective work using layers in 8- bit.

The problem seems to be that I can’t get adjustments right with any setting of Hue/Saturation sliders. Playing around with the large areas and using the info palette, I can see differences in RGB, but I don’t know how to directly vary R, G, and B independently.

My monitor is calibrated, and prints reproduce the image on the monitor well enough. I am using Windows.
————————-
Duncan
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R
Roy
May 14, 2005
"Duncan McBride" wrote in message
I have been using PSE since just before version 3 came out, and I have found invaluable help from other peoples’ posts on this forum as I have been learning. Thanks! I’m using PSE3 now, need help, and have not seen this topic covered.

I think my problem is both artistic and technical: Sometimes I can’t get Caucasian flesh colors right. I usually, but not always, do all right with photos taken in natural light, but artificial light, especially fluorescent light, is a problem. The flesh colors tend to a yellow-brown or a red-brown, depending on how high I crank the red saturation. I have been taking lots of candid portraits at small professional meetings, which are usually in windowless conference rooms lit by fluorescent lights, so this is a problem. I know fluorescent light is difficult, but I think I can do better.

To work on this I have used the eyedropper to copy some flesh colors, both good and defective, to large adjacent areas on a blank white background and tried to adjust them in isolation to see what works, and even there I am having trouble getting good matches.

Flesh colors vary, but I think our eye is especially sensitive to off color here, and I am particular about it. Other colors in the images are acceptable, so it’s not just a color cast. Does anyone have advice on this? Or know of a good reference?

See below for some details of what I am doing that might matter. ————————-
I am shooting RAW, opening with ACR in PSE3, adjusting white balance to get whites and greys correct (usually custom), making other ACR adjustments, converting to 16-bit .psd files, making adjustments I can there – Hue/Saturation, minor Levels adjustments, cropping – and then doing any selective work using layers in 8- bit.

The problem seems to be that I can’t get adjustments right with any setting of Hue/Saturation sliders. Playing around with the large areas and using the info palette, I can see differences in RGB, but I don’t know how to directly vary R, G, and B independently.

My monitor is calibrated, and prints reproduce the image on the monitor well enough. I am using Windows.
————————-
Duncan

Hi there.

"Hue Saturation" is not the best tool to use. Unfortunately E3 does not have "Curves" which is much better. Someone sells a book on E3, which has a cover CD that will install a "Curves" tool.

In Curves you can use the eyedropper to select true white and black, and you can also go into the Red, Blue and Green channels to adjust them individually.

That might help.

Roy G
KL
Kenneth_Liffmann
May 14, 2005
Duncan,

"Flesh colors vary, but I think our eye is especially sensitive to off color here, and I am particular about it. Other colors in the images are acceptable, so it’s not just a color cast. Does anyone have advice on this? Or know of a good reference?"

A reference which will help you is "The Hidden Power of Photoshop Elements 2" by Richard Lynch. He also has an updated version for Elements 3. The tools that come along for installation with purchase of the book allow for color separation, curves, etc. These tools allow you to enhance above and beyond the hue/saturation sliders, and /or the levels adjustments which are native to PE.

I have no commercial connection to above author or his publisher.

Ken
R
Roy
May 14, 2005
wrote in message
Duncan,

"Flesh colors vary, but I think our eye is especially sensitive to off color here, and I am particular about it. Other colors in the images are acceptable, so it’s not just a color cast. Does anyone have advice on this? Or know of a good reference?"

A reference which will help you is "The Hidden Power of Photoshop Elements 2" by Richard Lynch. He also has an updated version for Elements 3. The tools that come along for installation with purchase of the book allow for color separation, curves, etc. These tools allow you to enhance above and beyond the hue/saturation sliders, and /or the levels adjustments which are native to PE.

I have no commercial connection to above author or his publisher.
Ken

Yes.

That’s the book, I just could not remember the name.
Decrepitude marches on.

Roy G
DM
Duncan McBride
May 15, 2005
Ken —

Thanks much for the suggestion of Lynch, which I have to admit I own but haven’t installed yet. I know it will allow color separations, and I might have to go there. But I was hoping I didn’t.

I expect most photographers take pictures of people, sometimes under less than perfect light, and need to correct. Are there ways within PSE3 that people here use and that I may not have thought of, or may not be using well enough? I’m still definitely on the learning curve!

Duncan
CF
Callum_Ferguson
May 15, 2005
Duncan.
I can’t remember where I got it from, I’ve got writen down, Light skin as being R=246, G = 210, B = 183.
Probably a good place to start from
Cheers
Malcolm
KL
Kenneth_Liffmann
May 15, 2005
Duncan,

Using one of the selection tools or a layer mask, one can isolate a portion of a picture for enhancement:

1. Open image, duplicate background layer, shut off visibility of background layer and work on background copy layer
2. Select area with (e.g.) lasso and feather 5-15px
3. Create levels adjustment layer #1
4. Press CTRL + right icon in levels adj layer #1
5. Select original image
6. Select>Inverse
7. Create levels adjustment layer #2
8. Can adjust each layer independently by double clicking on the left icon to access the levels control box

There is also available a free download which may be useful for your purpose:

<http://www.optikvervelabs.com/default.asp>

Ken
MS
Mark_Sand
May 15, 2005
Take a look at these sites which give RGB values for various skin and hair tones:

<http://www.secretgovernmentlabs.com/page/skintone>

<http://www.secretgovernmentlabs.com/page/haircolor>
DM
Duncan McBride
May 15, 2005
Malcolm, Ken, Mark —

All this looks very useful at first glance. Specifically, the Virtual Photographer home page referred above shows pretty much the kind of problem I’m having, although more extreme. Thanks for the detailed instructions, Ken. And the color values give me something to go for when I’m wandering in the RGB wilderness.

I’ll work on this and let you know. I really appreciate the help.

Duncan
LM
Lou_M
May 15, 2005
I have been taking lots of candid portraits at small professional meetings, which are usually in windowless conference rooms lit by fluorescent lights, so this is a problem.

Duncan,

Any chance you can take a small gray card with you to these meetings? This could save you a ton of work. Just tell the PSE Raw converter to use the gray card with the eyedropper (to set the white/gray point) and use that setting in all subsequent pictures in those lighting conditions.

I haven’t done portraits a lot myself, but theoretically it sounds like using the gray card could get you 90% of the way there.
BB
Barbara_Brundage
May 16, 2005
A couple of coffee filters makes an easily folded substitute.
DM
Duncan McBride
May 16, 2005
Lou, Thanks. Using a gray card is a good idea. I have one of the standard 18%. I’ll try this to get the front end of the process as close as I can. The earlier suggestions are back-end corrections.

And, Barbara, I love your simple suggestion, especially since many of these conferences serve coffee, often in a filter pot, thus supplying my "gray" card for me, I expect around 70-80% reflective. Just casually leave an unused one on the table…..

Duncan
LM
Lou_M
May 16, 2005
🙂

And a lot cheaper than this:

< http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/accessories/whibal .shtml>
BB
Barbara_Brundage
May 16, 2005
many of these conferences serve coffee, often in a filter pot, thus supplying my "gray" card for me,

The only problem is when they try to be healthy and use the unbleached ones. 🙂
WE
Wendy_E_Williams
May 16, 2005
Barbara,

What a splendid tip 🙂

Wendy

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