Simple Collage in PE 3

AB
Posted By
Al_Brunck
May 21, 2005
Views
366
Replies
15
Status
Closed
I’m trying to create a simple collage with PE3, and am finding it much more difficult than I think it ought to be. I’m hoping that someone will point out something stupid I’m doing.

I want to print about 15 to 18 pictures on a single letter-size sheet. These photos will have been cropped (so they don’t have a fixed size) and I want to place and size them as I see fit. They will overlap — there is very little, if any, background visible. This is an iterative process, so I’ll be resizing and moving photos multiple times. PaintshopPro has a Print Layout function which allows me to do this, although it’s certainly not perfect.

From what I can gather, to do this in PE3 the conventional wisdom is to start with a blank document and add the photos on separate layers. I did this. However, I found two problems, one an annoyance, and the other a deal-killer, in my opinion.

The first problem is that when I resize using the move/transform control, it doesn’t maintain the aspect ratio unless I hold down the shift key. As far as I can tell, there’s no way to make that the default behavior. Once you start resizing, then it will let you lock the aspect ratio. I can’t tell you how many times I screwed this up. I know several ways to recover (which I’ve used many times), but I don’t understand why this is the default behavior.

The second, more serious problem, is that apparently when you resize a photo on a layer to a smaller size, it really does resample the picture and make it smaller. If you then resize it to make it bigger, you’ve lost resolution. This is a very bad thing when I’m constantly moving and resizing photos as I refine the collage. In the collage I worked on last night, as I added each photo, I sized it small so I could see them all on the sheet. Then I made them larger as I placed them. Bad idea.

I know that what I want to do CAN be done, it’s just that it appears to me that it is extremely inconvenient in PE3, unless I’m missing something. If I am, I’d sure like to know about it. Otherwise, I guess I’ll either use PaintshopPro for printing or try something else (any suggestions?).

Thanks.

Al Brunck
Related Tags
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CW
Colin Walls
May 21, 2005
Sorry Al, but you do actually seem to have the techniques covered.

The default behaviour of transforming without holding aspect ratio is consistent with other Windows software and the rest of the way PSE works. It becomes reasonably intuitive over time.

With regard to the resampling, you are quite right. But what else could it do? There is no way that different layers can have different resolutions [thank God!]. Again, I think that if you do this a lot you get used to not making components too small. You can, of course, just go back to the original image and scale down more conservatively. Just to be clear: the resampling only occurs when you commit the transform.
AB
Al_Brunck
May 21, 2005
First point: Other Windows programs I use do not work that way. I’m thinking of Visio, PowerPoint, etc. Of course, these are not primarily bit-mapped graphics editors.

Second point: I suppose you’re right. What I was hoping it would do is remember the original data, and use it when necessary (which is what PaintshopPro seems to do in Print Layout). As far as I can tell, I have to ‘commit the transform’ before I can select any other layer.

Maybe what I’m asking for is a new feature for PE3 (or PE4?).

Thanks for your reply.

Al Brunck
CW
Colin Walls
May 21, 2005
It was PowerPoint that I was thinking of, but I suppose SHIFT does modify drawing in a slightly different way.
DS
Dave Scott
May 22, 2005
If you have MS Word, it’s possible to create a collage with it and move pictures around that standard page. However, I can’t speak to the resizing issue – it’s likely that resolution would be lost.

wrote:
I’m trying to create a simple collage with PE3, and am finding it much more difficult than I think it ought to be. I’m hoping that someone will point out something stupid I’m doing.
JD
JIM_DOROUGH
May 24, 2005
I’VE HAD THE SAME PROBLEMS AND IT’S HARD TO BELIEVE THAT A PROGRAM OF THIS SIZE CAN’T HANDLE A SIMPLE COLLAGE. I HAVE HAD TO GO BACK TO MICROSOFT PITCURE IT 7.O AND CAN MAKE 8 1/2 X 11 COLLAGES WITH AS MANY PICTURES AS I WANT. IT’S SO SIMPLE THAT I CAN MAKE A COLLAGE IN ABOUT FIVE MIN.
TM
Tom Murray 1
May 24, 2005
Can shout, don’t hear you.
BH
Beth_Haney
May 24, 2005
Jim, I think Tom might have meant "Don’t shout, can hear you." 🙂

This software is no different than many others; some people just can’t get the hang of it whereas others have no problem. I’ve created many collages in five minutes or less, so maybe if you explain (in lower case letters) what kind of problem you’re having, someone can help you.
TM
Tom Murray 1
May 24, 2005
It’s from the Fire Sign Theater.
A comedy album of yesteryear.
BH
Beth_Haney
May 25, 2005
Sorry, Tom! Can you tell I’m not very savvy on comedy – of any era? 🙁
TM
Tom Murray 1
May 25, 2005
That’s ok Beth, it is a rather obscure reference.
BH
Beth_Haney
May 25, 2005
Thank you for trying to make me feel less out of it, even if you’re lying! 🙂 Although I’ve had so much practice at that you’d think it wouldn’t bother me anymore.
BV
Bill_Van_Noy
May 25, 2005
I have just spent hours on a similar problem. Only my problem is just the oposite. I’m cutting and pasting very large photos into a smaller banner photo. However, I’m getting the same results…pixelated photos. I’m not making smaller photos bigger, I’m making larger pictures smaller. This doesn’t make sense to me, but I’m rather new at all this. Thanks to anybody who can help. I’m against a tight deadline and hate to admit I don’t know what I’m doing (smile).
BH
Beth_Haney
May 25, 2005
My first guess is that the resolution of the image you’re pasting INTO (that you’re referring to as a banner photo) is set too low. Anything moved into it will be forced to take on the resolution of the base, so check and see what that is. If this is something you want to print, then you don’t want to go below 200ppi. The target is 300, but that isn’t cast in stone, either.

Post some specs, and we’ll double check what’s going on. Also clarify what you’ll be doing with this. If it’s something for the web, then the "rules" are a little different.

And, for goodness sake, I can’t imagine taking on a big project, not knowing what in the heck you’re doing, and having to have it done yesterday. 🙂
BV
Bill_Van_Noy
May 25, 2005
One of the photos to be cut and pasted is: 2848 pix wide, 2136 pix high, Res is 200 pix/inch (this is the one that becomes pixelated).

The photo background for this project is : 1568 pix wide, 391 pix high, Res is 195.714

As for your last comment, I’m afraid I don’t have the luxury of taking on or not taking on my projects nor can I determine the due dates. If you know of such a job, please tell me where I can send my resume (smile).

Thanks for you help.
KS
Karin_Sue
May 25, 2005
Al, when I do collages I usually have a pretty good idea what size I want my photos to end up and just go back to the original if I change my mind and want to go larger. I do have a possible workaround for you that I sometimes use. Start with large versions and duplicate the layers, name your layers to avoid confusion. Then hide one of each set. Play with the visible set. When done, you can match your large hidden layers to the final sizes, then delete the layers you used for experimenting.

Kari
Elements 2.0, Album 2.0, Windows XP
Photoshop 6, Mac OS 9.2

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