layers and file size

When I add an adjustment layer to my 200MB big file, the file size doubles, even when no mask is created on the adjustment layer. I would think a few bytes can describe the layer's settings.
Something for the next version?

In article <Vi_1e.49193$>,
"steven" wrote:

When I add an adjustment layer to my 200MB big file, the file size doubles, even when no mask is created on the adjustment layer. I would think a few bytes can describe the layer's settings.
Something for the next version?

That may be because when you save the image in .psd format, you have the option "Maximize Compatibility" checked.

If you are working in an image with no layers, "Maximize Compatibility" does nothing. If you have even one layer of any kind--adjustment, bitmap, vector, text, whatever--then "Maximize Compatibility" saves TWO copies of the image inside the .psd file--one flattened for programs that do not understand layers, and a second copy in layers. Turn off "Maximize Compatibility" and your file will shrink to half its size.

The option "Maximize Compatibility" is intended for if you want to open the Photoshop file in another program, which can read Photoshop 1.0 or Photoshop 2.x files but can not read Photoshop 3.0 or later files.

If you have no need of using the file in a program that only understands Photoshop 1 or Photoshop 2 files, then you should not turn on "Maximize Compatibility"--it makes the file significantly larger.

--
Art, photography, shareware, polyamory, literature, kink: all at http://www.xeromag.com/franklin.html

"Tacit" wrote in message

In article <Vi_1e.49193$>,
"steven" wrote:

When I add an adjustment layer to my 200MB big file, the file size

doubles,

even when no mask is created on the adjustment layer. I would think a

few

bytes can describe the layer's settings.
Something for the next version?

That may be because when you save the image in .psd format, you have the option "Maximize Compatibility" checked.

Thanks for the suggestion.
I tried changing "maximize PSD file compatibility" to "never", and also to "ask", where I unchecked the "maximize compatibility" checkbox, but the filesize remains 400MB. Did I overlook something?

Steven

In article <VQA2e.50730$>,
"steven" wrote:

I tried changing "maximize PSD file compatibility" to "never", and also to "ask", where I unchecked the "maximize compatibility" checkbox, but the filesize remains 400MB. Did I overlook something?

Are you somehow making a copy of the image background when you're adding the adjustment layer? If you are just adding an adjustment layer, and not duplicating the image layer or saving with "maximize compatibility" checked, the adjustment layer should add only a very small amount to the file size.

--
Art, photography, shareware, polyamory, literature, kink: all at http://www.xeromag.com/franklin.html

Tacit wrote:

In article <VQA2e.50730$>,
"steven" wrote:

I tried changing "maximize PSD file compatibility" to "never", and also to "ask", where I unchecked the "maximize compatibility" checkbox, but the filesize remains 400MB. Did I overlook something?

Are you somehow making a copy of the image background when you're adding the adjustment layer? If you are just adding an adjustment layer, and not duplicating the image layer or saving with "maximize compatibility" checked, the adjustment layer should add only a very small amount to the file size.

I think the answer is very simple. If you have saved a file once with 'maximize PSD file compatibility', turning this option off again may not change that file. Try it on a new file to see if that was indeed the problem.

--
Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/

"Johan W. Elzenga" wrote in message

Tacit wrote:

In article <VQA2e.50730$>,
"steven" wrote:

I tried changing "maximize PSD file compatibility" to "never", and

also to

"ask", where I unchecked the "maximize compatibility" checkbox, but

the

filesize remains 400MB. Did I overlook something?

Are you somehow making a copy of the image background when you're adding the adjustment layer? If you are just adding an adjustment layer, and not duplicating the image layer or saving with "maximize compatibility" checked, the adjustment layer should add only a very small amount to the file size.

I think the answer is very simple. If you have saved a file once with 'maximize PSD file compatibility', turning this option off again may not change that file. Try it on a new file to see if that was indeed the problem.

--
Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/

Thanks for the reply, Johan.

I tried the following (in PS CS):
- select and copy the full image
- create new image, paste copied image from clipboard
- the image is now in a new layer, so I flatten the image to get rid of the (empty) background
- save the image: 200MB
- create brightness/contrast layer with default brightness and contrast values, no mask
- save. PS shows the "format options" dialog with the "maximize compatibility" checkbox checked. I uncheck it and save. the statusbar shows "generating full resolution composite" before "writing photoshop format". saved file is 400MB.
- I switch to "desperate" mode: save as... and uncheck the ICC profile checkbox. I don't get the "generating full resolution composite" message, which looks hopeful, but alas: still 400MB.
- in "utmost desperate" mode I save again with the "maximize compatibility" checkbox checked (which seems to be the default. I'd appreciate it if PS remembered my previous choice): 400MB.

Starts to look more and more like a bug to me. :-(
anyone an original idea? er.. regarding this problem, that is ;-)

Steven

On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 19:27:41 GMT, "steven"
wrote:

Thanks for the reply, Johan.

I tried the following (in PS CS):
- select and copy the full image
- create new image, paste copied image from clipboard
- the image is now in a new layer, so I flatten the image to get rid of the (empty) background
- save the image: 200MB
- create brightness/contrast layer with default brightness and contrast values, no mask
- save. PS shows the "format options" dialog with the "maximize compatibility" checkbox checked. I uncheck it and save. the statusbar shows "generating full resolution composite" before "writing photoshop format". saved file is 400MB.
- I switch to "desperate" mode: save as... and uncheck the ICC profile checkbox. I don't get the "generating full resolution composite" message, which looks hopeful, but alas: still 400MB.
- in "utmost desperate" mode I save again with the "maximize compatibility" checkbox checked (which seems to be the default. I'd appreciate it if PS remembered my previous choice): 400MB.

Starts to look more and more like a bug to me. :-(
anyone an original idea? er.. regarding this problem, that is ;-)
Steven

Try opening a *completely new image* - one that you *haven't* worked on before. Note the size. Add an adjustment layer. Save it and note the size.

--

Hecate - The Real One

Fashion: Buying things you don't need, with money
you don't have, to impress people you don't like...

steven wrote:

Thanks for the reply, Johan.

I tried the following (in PS CS):
- select and copy the full image
- create new image, paste copied image from clipboard
- the image is now in a new layer, so I flatten the image to get rid of the (empty) background
- save the image: 200MB
- create brightness/contrast layer with default brightness and contrast values, no mask
- save. PS shows the "format options" dialog with the "maximize compatibility" checkbox checked. I uncheck it and save. the statusbar shows "generating full resolution composite" before "writing photoshop format". saved file is 400MB.
- I switch to "desperate" mode: save as... and uncheck the ICC profile checkbox. I don't get the "generating full resolution composite" message, which looks hopeful, but alas: still 400MB.
- in "utmost desperate" mode I save again with the "maximize compatibility" checkbox checked (which seems to be the default. I'd appreciate it if PS remembered my previous choice): 400MB.

Starts to look more and more like a bug to me. :-(

Are you using 16 bits images for this experiment? For 16 bits images it seems that Adobe is using a different method, that indeed does increase the file size considerably. For 8 bits images an adjustment layer will hardly increase the file size at all.

--
Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/

"Johan W. Elzenga" wrote in message

steven wrote:

Thanks for the reply, Johan.

I tried the following (in PS CS):
- select and copy the full image
- create new image, paste copied image from clipboard
- the image is now in a new layer, so I flatten the image to get rid of

the

(empty) background
- save the image: 200MB
- create brightness/contrast layer with default brightness and contrast values, no mask
- save. PS shows the "format options" dialog with the "maximize compatibility" checkbox checked. I uncheck it and save. the statusbar shows "generating full resolution composite" before

"writing

photoshop format". saved file is 400MB.
- I switch to "desperate" mode: save as... and uncheck the ICC profile checkbox. I don't get the "generating full resolution composite"

message,

which looks hopeful, but alas: still 400MB.
- in "utmost desperate" mode I save again with the "maximize

compatibility"

checkbox checked (which seems to be the default. I'd appreciate it if PS remembered my previous choice): 400MB.

Starts to look more and more like a bug to me. :-(

Are you using 16 bits images for this experiment? For 16 bits images it seems that Adobe is using a different method, that indeed does increase the file size considerably. For 8 bits images an adjustment layer will hardly increase the file size at all.

You're right, I should have mentioned that I was working in 16bit mode. Works fine in 8bit like you said.
Thanks a bunch.

Steven

And uncheck Maximum compatibility unless you plan on opening the file in a really old version of PS.

Steve

--- faith \'fath\ n : firm belief in something for which there is no proof. Webster's Dictionary

From: "steven"
Organization: Telenet Internet
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.photoshop
Date: Fri, 01 Apr 2005 15:32:57 GMT
Subject: Re: layers and file size

"Johan W. Elzenga" wrote in message

steven wrote:

Thanks for the reply, Johan.

I tried the following (in PS CS):
- select and copy the full image
- create new image, paste copied image from clipboard
- the image is now in a new layer, so I flatten the image to get rid of

the

(empty) background
- save the image: 200MB
- create brightness/contrast layer with default brightness and contrast values, no mask
- save. PS shows the "format options" dialog with the "maximize compatibility" checkbox checked. I uncheck it and save. the statusbar shows "generating full resolution composite" before

"writing

photoshop format". saved file is 400MB.
- I switch to "desperate" mode: save as... and uncheck the ICC profile checkbox. I don't get the "generating full resolution composite"

message,

which looks hopeful, but alas: still 400MB.
- in "utmost desperate" mode I save again with the "maximize

compatibility"

checkbox checked (which seems to be the default. I'd appreciate it if PS remembered my previous choice): 400MB.

Starts to look more and more like a bug to me. :-(

Are you using 16 bits images for this experiment? For 16 bits images it seems that Adobe is using a different method, that indeed does increase the file size considerably. For 8 bits images an adjustment layer will hardly increase the file size at all.

You're right, I should have mentioned that I was working in 16bit mode. Works fine in 8bit like you said.
Thanks a bunch.

Steven

Monty Jake Monty wrote:

And uncheck Maximum compatibility unless you plan on opening the file in a really old version of PS.

Please read the whole discussion before you react. That was exactly what people suggested a long time ago, but that is not the problem in this case. The problem is that Adjustment Layers in 16 bits files are apparently very different.

--
Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/

I read the 16 bit part of the discussion. I meant in addition to everything else that was in the part that I responding to. Sorry that the earliest parts of the discussion were not in the post that I was responding too and were missed.

Steve

--- faith \'fath\ n : firm belief in something for which there is no proof. Webster's Dictionary

From: (Johan W. Elzenga)
Organization: Editor / Photographer
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.photoshop
Date: Fri, 1 Apr 2005 18:27:28 +0200
Subject: Re: layers and file size

Monty Jake Monty wrote:

And uncheck Maximum compatibility unless you plan on opening the file in a really old version of PS.

Please read the whole discussion before you react. That was exactly what people suggested a long time ago, but that is not the problem in this case. The problem is that Adjustment Layers in 16 bits files are apparently very different.

--
Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/

In article <NaY2e.51741$>,
"steven" wrote:

the statusbar shows "generating full resolution composite" before "writing photoshop format". saved file is 400MB.

In your save options, did you by any chance choose to save a full-size preview? You have the option of saving an icon, a thumbnail, and a full-size preview. A full-size preview is quite large and occupies a significant bit of space.

--
Art, photography, shareware, polyamory, literature, kink: all at http://www.xeromag.com/franklin.html