How many are deciding NOT to purchase CS because of activation?

A
Posted By
Alberich
Feb 11, 2004
Views
1388
Replies
57
Status
Closed
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. I won’t have to worry about spyware telling Adobe I’ve changed my video card adapter and having that company tell me it’s a "minor change’ that won’t "trigger" the activation mode. I won’t have to "cross" my fingers and praying the reinstallation of my LEGALLY purchased copy does’t give me the "no go" sign and be forced to explain to some tech support in God knows where and tell him/her why I’m doing what I’m doing.

I’m also glad I purchased the Illustrator CS upgrade as well. At least this product didn’t have the activation built. But this may beh the last time I get an Adobe line of upgrades. Because probably from this point on they’re going to force activation on each of their product line of applications. No more Photoshop or Illustrator and no more wishes for InDesign either. I’ll have to switch over to Corel, Deneba, or Creature House if I want drawling tools I cand purchase with confidence and not worry about "activation". I wanted to buy Macromedia Freehand but when I heard they went the activation route…I kissed that product goodbye. Anybody out there thinking like me on this issue?
N
niknik1971
Feb 11, 2004
What OS are you running??
Should we not run XP and stick with ME, 98 or even 95 because you have to activate XP ?
I have NIS 2004 should I have not got it due to the fact it needs activating ?

If you own it you should have no worries about activating. Activating is a pain but it should not put anybody of getting the product. What should be part of your decision making is whether the new product has enough new features that makes it worth paying the extra money for it.

NIK

"Alberich" wrote in message
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. I won’t have to worry about spyware telling Adobe I’ve changed my video card adapter and having that company tell me it’s a "minor change’ that won’t "trigger" the activation mode. I won’t have to "cross" my fingers and praying the reinstallation of my LEGALLY purchased copy does’t give me the "no go" sign and be forced to explain to some tech support in God knows where and tell him/her why I’m doing what I’m doing.

I’m also glad I purchased the Illustrator CS upgrade as well. At least this product didn’t have the activation built. But this may beh the last time I get an Adobe line of upgrades. Because probably from this point on they’re going to force activation on each of their product line of applications. No more Photoshop or Illustrator and no more wishes for InDesign either. I’ll have to switch over to Corel, Deneba, or Creature House if I want drawling tools I cand purchase with confidence and not worry about "activation". I wanted to buy Macromedia Freehand but when I heard they went the activation route…I kissed that product goodbye. Anybody out there thinking like me on this issue?
BN
Brooklyn NYC
Feb 11, 2004
"nik" wrote in message
What OS are you running??
Should we not run XP and stick with ME, 98 or even 95 because you have to activate XP ?
I have NIS 2004 should I have not got it due to the fact it needs
activating
?

If you own it you should have no worries about activating. Activating is a pain but it should not put anybody of getting the product. What should be part of your decision making is whether the new product has enough new features that makes it worth paying the extra money for it.
NIK

"Alberich" wrote in message
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. I won’t have to worry about spyware telling Adobe I’ve changed my video card adapter and having that company tell me it’s a "minor change’ that won’t "trigger" the activation mode. I won’t have to "cross" my fingers and praying the reinstallation of my LEGALLY purchased copy does’t give me the "no go" sign and be forced to explain to some tech support in God knows where and tell him/her why I’m doing what I’m doing.

I’m also glad I purchased the Illustrator CS upgrade as well. At least this product didn’t have the activation built. But this may beh the last time I get an Adobe line of upgrades. Because probably from this point on they’re going to force activation on each of their product line of applications. No more Photoshop or Illustrator and no more wishes for InDesign either. I’ll have to switch over to Corel, Deneba, or Creature House if I want drawling tools I cand purchase with confidence and not worry about "activation". I wanted to buy Macromedia Freehand but when I heard they went the activation route…I kissed that product goodbye. Anybody out there thinking like me on this issue?

I bought the complete Adobe CS and didn’t care about the activation. Yeah, it is a downer that activation is working that way. I guess we are all paying the price of piracy. It probably won’t stop there either.
QO
Queen of Denial
Feb 11, 2004
I have had to re-activate CS since I bought it because my HD failed and had to install new OS on another drive, worked out fine.
"Alberich" wrote in message
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. I won’t have to worry about spyware telling Adobe I’ve changed my video card adapter and having that company tell me it’s a "minor change’ that won’t "trigger" the activation mode. I won’t have to "cross" my fingers and praying the reinstallation of my LEGALLY purchased copy does’t give me the "no go" sign and be forced to explain to some tech support in God knows where and tell him/her why I’m doing what I’m doing.

I’m also glad I purchased the Illustrator CS upgrade as well. At least this product didn’t have the activation built. But this may beh the last time I get an Adobe line of upgrades. Because probably from this point on they’re going to force activation on each of their product line of applications. No more Photoshop or Illustrator and no more wishes for InDesign either. I’ll have to switch over to Corel, Deneba, or Creature House if I want drawling tools I cand purchase with confidence and not worry about "activation". I wanted to buy Macromedia Freehand but when I heard they went the activation route…I kissed that product goodbye. Anybody out there thinking like me on this issue?
L
llutton
Feb 12, 2004
Photoshop CS is the best upgrade I’ve ever done. I only hope those who choose not to do the upgrade aren’t photographers. I think all photographers need it. Especially those who would like to shoot RAW images and work in 16 bit mode. Also, I was shocked how much the highlight/shadow enhancement has greatly improved many images. Text on a curve – that’s pretty good also. I’ve had it a month now and I’m still excited.
Lynn

I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. I won’t have to worry about spyware telling Adobe I’ve changed my video card adapter and having that company tell me it’s a "minor change’ that won’t "trigger" the activation mode. I won’t have to "cross" my fingers and praying the reinstallation of my LEGALLY purchased copy does’t give me the "no go" sign and be forced to explain to some tech support in God knows where and tell him/her why I’m doing what I’m doing.

I’m also glad I purchased the Illustrator CS upgrade as well. At least this product didn’t have the activation built. But this may beh the last time I get an Adobe line of upgrades. Because probably from this point on they’re going to force activation on each of their product line of applications. No more Photoshop or Illustrator and no more wishes for InDesign either. I’ll have to switch over to Corel, Deneba, or Creature House if I want drawling tools I cand purchase with confidence and not worry about "activation". I wanted to buy Macromedia Freehand but when I heard they went the activation route…I kissed that product goodbye. Anybody out there thinking like me on this issue?

I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. I won’t have to worry about spyware telling Adobe I’ve changed my video card adapter and having that company tell me it’s a "minor change’ that won’t "trigger" the activation mode. I won’t have to "cross" my fingers and praying the reinstallation of my LEGALLY purchased copy does’t give me the "no go" sign and be forced to explain to some tech support in God knows where and tell him/her why I’m doing what I’m doing.

I’m also glad I purchased the Illustrator CS upgrade as well. At least this product didn’t have the activation built. But this may beh the last time I get an Adobe line of upgrades. Because probably from this point on they’re going to force activation on each of their product line of applications. No more Photoshop or Illustrator and no more wishes for InDesign either. I’ll have to switch over to Corel, Deneba, or Creature House if I want drawling tools I cand purchase with confidence and not worry about "activation". I wanted to buy Macromedia Freehand but when I heard they went the activation route…I kissed that product goodbye. Anybody out there thinking like me on this issue?
EG
Eric Gill
Feb 12, 2004
"nik" wrote in
news:c0ed69$81k$:

What OS are you running??

2K.

Should we not run XP and stick with ME, 98 or even 95 because you have to activate XP ?

No. I should stick to 2K because Microsoft is adding things such as activation to newer versions of Windows. And Palladium (or whatever they’ve renamed it this week to try to defuse consumer backlash) is just horrendous.

I have NIS 2004 should I have not got it due to the fact it needs activating ?

If you own it you should have no worries about activating.

Except, of course, such as when Microsoft expires the activation.

And, of course, such as when I tried XP dual boot and it would not activate properly. Fortunate I was not relying on XP, no?

Activating is a pain but it should not put anybody of getting the product.

Yes, it certainly should.

What should be part of your decision making is whether the new product has enough new features that makes it worth paying the extra money for it.

Yet another concern is if the maker is considering your best interests or not. M$ and Adobe are both starting to not do so. This is behavior I will not reward.
EG
Eric Gill
Feb 12, 2004
"Brooklyn NYC" wrote in
news:06zWb.619$:

I bought the complete Adobe CS and didn’t care about the activation. Yeah, it is a downer that activation is working that way. I guess we are all paying the price of piracy.

The pirates broke the activation within 24 hours of release, as usually happens.

It’s not about piracy. It’s about corporate control

It probably won’t stop there either.

No doubt.
H
Hecate
Feb 12, 2004
On Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:56:57 -0800, "Digital Art Resources" wrote:

I have had to re-activate CS since I bought it because my HD failed and had to install new OS on another drive, worked out fine.

Ah yes, but three strikes and you’re out. The fourth time you try that you’ll practically have to go personally with your disks to Adobe before they’ll believe that you have a legitimate copy.



Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
H
Hecate
Feb 12, 2004
On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 02:06:02 GMT, Eric Gill
wrote:

"nik" wrote in
news:c0ed69$81k$:

What OS are you running??

2K.

Should we not run XP and stick with ME, 98 or even 95 because you have to activate XP ?

No. I should stick to 2K because Microsoft is adding things such as activation to newer versions of Windows. And Palladium (or whatever they’ve renamed it this week to try to defuse consumer backlash) is just horrendous.

Caveat: Unless you buy MS business software. Then there’s no activation.

As for buying PSCS, no I wouldn’t. However, it’s cheaper for me buy the upgrade CS suite than the several programs I need to upgrade. So, then I’ll have the choice of whether I’m actually going to install it. I may do as I’ll still have 7.01 to fall back on. But when they have activation on all their products, unless I can avoid it by purchasing a business version (and that means justifying x number of copies) I won’t be buying any more Adobe products. I’d love to say the same about Macromedia, but Dreamweaver is vital and the only not-as-good alternative is Go Live and we’re back to Adobe again.



Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
B
broga
Feb 12, 2004
The two problems with software protection in general are that it doesn’t actually protect anything and that it causes more hassle and aggravation to legitimate owners than to those who have a pirate copy.

It’s not just Adobe who can’t see farther than the end of the sales managers nose.

Whenever I used to rent or buy a video tape I had to fast forward through 5 minutes of some moron droning on about video piracy – did anybody actually listen to this rubbish. Pirate copies were much easier to use because they had that bit edited out

So called regional dvd’s can be played on almost any computer – and simple dvd players are now so cheap you can buy one for almost the same price as a dvd, so just buy two for two different regions. I dont really want 2 players but if I can buy my discs cheaper outside the uk I might just do that

Cds that wouldn’t play on computers were a novelty for about two months until all the kids discovered that the protection could be destroyed in seconds. It was only the moms and dads that bought legit copies who struggled

Hacks and cracks and serials for all programs appear within days of the products launch. No problem at all for the pirates but a pain in posterior for those who lose their serials, activation codes etc.

All this would be a bit of a joke, apart from the built in spyware. Is this spyware legal? What gives US software companies the right to download sensitive commercial information about computer construction in other countries?

In any case none of this actually matters. Linux is rapidly losing it’s geek image and once companies realise that its cheaper to support open source software than pay thousands in licencing fees then the industry standards will change and several well known software giants will go the way of the Dodo


www.micromountain.com
"Alberich" wrote in message
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. I won’t have to worry about spyware telling Adobe I’ve changed my video card adapter and having that company tell me it’s a "minor change’ that won’t "trigger" the activation mode. I won’t have to "cross" my fingers and praying the reinstallation of my LEGALLY purchased copy does’t give me the "no go" sign and be forced to explain to some tech support in God knows where and tell him/her why I’m doing what I’m doing.

I’m also glad I purchased the Illustrator CS upgrade as well. At least this product didn’t have the activation built. But this may beh the last time I get an Adobe line of upgrades. Because probably from this point on they’re going to force activation on each of their product line of applications. No more Photoshop or Illustrator and no more wishes for InDesign either. I’ll have to switch over to Corel, Deneba, or Creature House if I want drawling tools I cand purchase with confidence and not worry about "activation". I wanted to buy Macromedia Freehand but when I heard they went the activation route…I kissed that product goodbye. Anybody out there thinking like me on this issue?
G
Glenn
Feb 12, 2004
"Alberich" wrote in message
No more Photoshop or Illustrator and no more wishes for
InDesign either. I’ll have to switch over to Corel, Deneba, or Creature House if I want drawling tools I cand purchase with confidence and not worry about "activation". I wanted to buy Macromedia Freehand but when I heard they went the activation route…I kissed that product goodbye. Anybody out there thinking like me on this issue?

Yes, don’t purchase any professional level software, that will show them ! Don’t purchase Deep3D Paint or DeepUV, they have activation also … Oh 3DMax and ….. I really think that you are over reacting.

Glenn
A
ausclicks
Feb 12, 2004
This activation thing is all a bit of a joke.
I used the Paradox pirated version up until it stopped working. I was so impressed with the software I went and bought a full version. How’s that for killing off the pirate users? I guess I could have opted for an upgrade version by having a pirate of version 6 on the PC but I got a dose of honesty and shelled out for the full version!

I entered the Adobe serial number but instead of activating it, I used a ‘key generator’ I got off the ‘net to provide the activation data. The PC it’s installed on is never connected to the Internet and I couldn’t be bothered hanging on a phone, entering numbers to get another set of numbers.

So, all I had to do to keep using the pirate version was to set the PCs clock back a year but I choose to pay for what I had (by then) confirmed was the best editing program for digital images I have ever used. Congratulations Adobe. I’m stoked. You might not have expected this was how you’d sell more software but it just goes to show that *shareware* is a valid concept.

As for all those who complain about activation? Get a life. Put your money where your mouth is and actually buy the program. There’s nothing in the EULA that says you can’t use another activation method than the one Adobe have.

DM
—————————————-

"Alberich" wrote in message
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. I won’t have to worry about spyware telling Adobe I’ve changed my video card adapter and having that company tell me it’s a "minor change’ that won’t "trigger" the activation mode. I won’t have to "cross" my fingers and praying the reinstallation of my LEGALLY purchased copy does’t give me the "no go" sign and be forced to explain to some tech support in God knows where and tell him/her why I’m doing what I’m doing.

I’m also glad I purchased the Illustrator CS upgrade as well. At least this product didn’t have the activation built. But this may beh the last time I get an Adobe line of upgrades. Because probably from this point on they’re going to force activation on each of their product line of applications. No more Photoshop or Illustrator and no more wishes for InDesign either. I’ll have to switch over to Corel, Deneba, or Creature House if I want drawling tools I cand purchase with confidence and not worry about "activation". I wanted to buy Macromedia Freehand but when I heard they went the activation route…I kissed that product goodbye. Anybody out there thinking like me on this issue?
A
Alberich
Feb 12, 2004
In article ,
says…
Photoshop CS is the best upgrade I’ve ever done. I only hope those who choose not to do the upgrade aren’t photographers. I think all photographers need it. Especially those who would like to shoot RAW images and work in 16 bit mode. Also, I was shocked how much the highlight/shadow enhancement has greatly improved many images. Text on a curve – that’s pretty good also. I’ve had it a month now and I’m still excited.
Lynn

I have news for you, Lynn. I don’t have to worry about not getting access to Text on a path in my copy of Photoshop 7.0. You know why? Because I can fire up my copy of Adobe Illustrator CS (no activation there…yet) and type my lettering on the path in there. I do all the refinements in Illustrator CS. Once I’m satisfied…I drag and drop the image right into Photoshop 7.0, which automatically rasterizes my artwork and instantly creates layers for each of the elements that’s imported into Photoshop 7.0. Done. That’s it.

Oh…I guess I’m going to miss such refinements like saving History sets as a file, etc. I’m also going to be doing without the new Highlight and Shadow tool in Photoshop CS. I’m also going to have to miss out on the new feature of saving Photoshop images as comps…using new features in the Layer palatte. Plus, the ability to access native RAW files from digital images downloaded from cameras. Those are indeed nice improvements for Photoshop…but the big catch is…to get these improvements…I have to put up with Activation. Which by the way…isn’t well implemented. It’s causing Photoshop CS to load too slowly for many people who’ve been complaining about it on the web forums I’ve read, and some video card implementations aren’t compatible. Like some from NVidia for crying out loud!

I’m also hearing that Adobe screwed up the upgrade options for those who have earlier than 5.5 versions of Photoshop. For example…I’m a licensed user of Photoshop 4.0 for Windows. But the Photoshop CS upgrade only gives users the option to upgrade if they’re licensed to versions
5.5 and above. Now…I’ve been upgrading Version 4 to 5 and 6…but I’m
not clear as to whether the Photoshop CS upgrade would allow me to use the Photoshop upgrade CDs I have that include 5.0 and 6.0 versions even though the serial number I have is for Photoshop 4.0. So there you go. I am so glad I spent my hard earned money on what may very well be the LAST pre activation versions of Adobe products I ever buy in my lifetime. I’m trying to get my hands on the PageMaker upgrade to InDesign CS right now…but my suspicion is this will have the activation built in by the time I get my hands on it. If that’s the case…I’ll immediately ask for a refund without opening the software wrapping and stick with old PageMaker 7.0 with only one level of undo. What’s a poor guy like me to do? I have to make do with what I can get my hands on. And that’s the way it goes. I’m sure even Bugs Bunny would approve of my battle plan here. There’s no reason why I have to lay down and let Adobe steamroller over me with activation and choke the lifeblood out of me.

So long, Adobe. You’ve been a good company while it lasted. But now you’re screwing with me and my hard earned money. I’m no longer giving you any more of my blood sweat and tears. I’m now seriously looking at Corel. I just visited my local Circuit City superstore and they have on sale the CorelDraw suite 11 upgrade for just 160 bucks! Version 12 just came out and I’ll be looking at that one’s price and specifications as well. And best thing about it…they allow cross upgrades from Adobe Illustrator and Photoshop. Yummy, yummy! And even BETTER…nooooo activation. That’s the bargain sealer for me.
EG
Eric Gill
Feb 12, 2004
"Douglas MacDonald" wrote in
news:0LCWb.52471$:

<snip>

As for all those who complain about activation? Get a life. Put your money where your mouth is and actually buy the program.

I purchased my first version of Photoshop before it had that name.

You?
A
ausclicks
Feb 12, 2004
Well Eric,
I bought Version 3.0 of Photoshop which I upgraded through to 5 before ditching it in favour of Corel Draw Suite which has Corel PhotoPaint. I have upgraded Corel from version 3.0 through to version 11. Early last year I began the transition from Film to Digital photography and discovered that Corel wasn’t up to the task of handling 100’s of digital images.

Corel works well enough to handle the small amount of image I scanned but as for doing what PhotoShop CS does? No way. I pulled a pirate copy of Photoshop CS from Russia (not with love) and got stoked with Photoshop all over again.

As for the possibility I would have just bought Photoshop on it’s reputation? No. If I hadn’t been able to use it for a few months and discover it’s flaws (it has those too) and benefits, I never would have bought it. If you are a digital Photographer at a professional level, you might think you can do without CS but the sheer power of it’s photo handling means you are losing money by not having it.

DM
—————-

"Eric Gill" wrote in message
"Douglas MacDonald" wrote in
news:0LCWb.52471$:

<snip>

As for all those who complain about activation? Get a life. Put your money where your mouth is and actually buy the program.

I purchased my first version of Photoshop before it had that name.
You?
TE
Tin Ear
Feb 12, 2004
"Alberich" wrote in message
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. I won’t have to worry about spyware telling Adobe I’ve changed my video card adapter and having that company tell me it’s a "minor change’ that won’t "trigger" the activation mode. I won’t have to "cross" my fingers and praying the reinstallation of my LEGALLY purchased copy does’t give me the "no go" sign and be forced to explain to some tech support in God knows where and tell him/her why I’m doing what I’m doing.

I’m also glad I purchased the Illustrator CS upgrade as well. At least this product didn’t have the activation built. But this may beh the last time I get an Adobe line of upgrades. Because probably from this point on they’re going to force activation on each of their product line of applications. No more Photoshop or Illustrator and no more wishes for InDesign either. I’ll have to switch over to Corel, Deneba, or Creature House if I want drawling tools I cand purchase with confidence and not worry about "activation". I wanted to buy Macromedia Freehand but when I heard they went the activation route…I kissed that product goodbye. Anybody out there thinking like me on this issue?

I’m sick of these threads. Get over it! You buy / use a product because you feel it is the best tool for the job, because the company has worked to build a relationship with it’s users and because you know there is a community of support for it. Anything else. I fell, is immaterial.
EG
Eric Gill
Feb 12, 2004
"Douglas MacDonald" wrote in
news:S7EWb.52547$:

Well Eric,
I bought Version 3.0 of Photoshop which I upgraded through to 5 before ditching it in favour of

My point was I *have* put my money where my mouth is. I have, in fact, purchased every commercially availble version of Photoshop until CS.

To say that I do not feel adequately rewarded for that loyalty is putting the case far too mildly.

<snip>

As for the possibility I would have just bought Photoshop on it’s reputation? No. If I hadn’t been able to use it for a few months and discover it’s flaws (it has those too) and benefits, I never would have bought it. If you are a digital Photographer at a professional level,

I am. And a professional layout artist.

you might think you can do without CS but the sheer power of it’s photo handling means you are losing money by not having it.

Indeed?

How so?

"Eric Gill" wrote in message
"Douglas MacDonald" wrote in
news:0LCWb.52471$:

<snip>

As for all those who complain about activation? Get a life. Put your money where your mouth is and actually buy the program.

I purchased my first version of Photoshop before it had that name.
You?

QO
Queen of Denial
Feb 12, 2004
as long as the number is toll free, if I have to pay for the call then balking becomes an issue.
"Hecate" wrote in message
On Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:56:57 -0800, "Digital Art Resources" wrote:

I have had to re-activate CS since I bought it because my HD failed and
had
to install new OS on another drive, worked out fine.

Ah yes, but three strikes and you’re out. The fourth time you try that you’ll practically have to go personally with your disks to Adobe before they’ll believe that you have a legitimate copy.



Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
TA
Timo Autiokari
Feb 12, 2004
"nik" wrote:

What OS are you running??

98se and 2kpro.

Should we not run XP and stick with ME, 98 or even 95
because you have to activate XP ?

I do so and will not upgrade the 9 systems I am responsible for to the CS due to the activation.

If you own it you should have no worries about activating.

I own my house too and no service provider walks in through the front door using their own key. Instead they ring the bell and I open the door in case I choose to do so. The same policy is in effect with the network "door" also.

What comes to the security situation on the Internet today every communication software that you install will increase the probability of virus infection or total overtake of your system considerably. The risk is even much higher with hideous cryptic surveillance tools like the activation since these are difficult to manage, you do not know what they actually do. So when the activation code is infected by a virus or a backdoor trojan you (and your firewall) can only happily believe that it is the activation check going on and not that your password lists are being sent out.

Activating is a pain but it should not put anybody of getting the product. What should be part of your decision making is whether the new product has enough new features that makes it worth paying the extra money for it.

I have no problems with the 98se and PS 7.0.1 the system works just similarly well as it did before the CS was published.

Timo Autiokari
SM
Steve Moody
Feb 12, 2004
In article , Alberich
wrote:

my hands on. And that’s the way it goes. I’m sure even Bugs Bunny would approve of my battle plan here. There’s no reason why I have to lay down and let Adobe steamroller over me with activation and choke the lifeblood out of me.

Say that again. This time without the hyperbole.
QO
Queen of Denial
Feb 12, 2004
In answer to youor upgrade question in terms of an older Photoshop serial, I upgraded CS from version 3 which was upgraded to 7 no fuss. "Alberich" wrote in message
In article ,
says…
Photoshop CS is the best upgrade I’ve ever done. I only hope those who
choose
not to do the upgrade aren’t photographers. I think all photographers
need it.
Especially those who would like to shoot RAW images and work in 16 bit
mode.
Also, I was shocked how much the highlight/shadow enhancement has
greatly
improved many images. Text on a curve – that’s pretty good also. I’ve
had it a
month now and I’m still excited.
Lynn

I have news for you, Lynn. I don’t have to worry about not getting access to Text on a path in my copy of Photoshop 7.0. You know why? Because I can fire up my copy of Adobe Illustrator CS (no activation there…yet) and type my lettering on the path in there. I do all the refinements in Illustrator CS. Once I’m satisfied…I drag and drop the image right into Photoshop 7.0, which automatically rasterizes my artwork and instantly creates layers for each of the elements that’s imported into Photoshop 7.0. Done. That’s it.

Oh…I guess I’m going to miss such refinements like saving History sets as a file, etc. I’m also going to be doing without the new Highlight and Shadow tool in Photoshop CS. I’m also going to have to miss out on the new feature of saving Photoshop images as comps…using new features in the Layer palatte. Plus, the ability to access native RAW files from digital images downloaded from cameras. Those are indeed nice improvements for Photoshop…but the big catch is…to get these improvements…I have to put up with Activation. Which by the way…isn’t well implemented. It’s causing Photoshop CS to load too slowly for many people who’ve been complaining about it on the web forums I’ve read, and some video card implementations aren’t compatible. Like some from NVidia for crying out loud!

I’m also hearing that Adobe screwed up the upgrade options for those who have earlier than 5.5 versions of Photoshop. For example…I’m a licensed user of Photoshop 4.0 for Windows. But the Photoshop CS upgrade only gives users the option to upgrade if they’re licensed to versions
5.5 and above. Now…I’ve been upgrading Version 4 to 5 and 6…but I’m
not clear as to whether the Photoshop CS upgrade would allow me to use the Photoshop upgrade CDs I have that include 5.0 and 6.0 versions even though the serial number I have is for Photoshop 4.0. So there you go. I am so glad I spent my hard earned money on what may very well be the LAST pre activation versions of Adobe products I ever buy in my lifetime. I’m trying to get my hands on the PageMaker upgrade to InDesign CS right now…but my suspicion is this will have the activation built in by the time I get my hands on it. If that’s the case…I’ll immediately ask for a refund without opening the software wrapping and stick with old PageMaker 7.0 with only one level of undo. What’s a poor guy like me to do? I have to make do with what I can get my hands on. And that’s the way it goes. I’m sure even Bugs Bunny would approve of my battle plan here. There’s no reason why I have to lay down and let Adobe steamroller over me with activation and choke the lifeblood out of me.

So long, Adobe. You’ve been a good company while it lasted. But now you’re screwing with me and my hard earned money. I’m no longer giving you any more of my blood sweat and tears. I’m now seriously looking at Corel. I just visited my local Circuit City superstore and they have on sale the CorelDraw suite 11 upgrade for just 160 bucks! Version 12 just came out and I’ll be looking at that one’s price and specifications as well. And best thing about it…they allow cross upgrades from Adobe Illustrator and Photoshop. Yummy, yummy! And even BETTER…nooooo activation. That’s the bargain sealer for me.
A
ausclicks
Feb 12, 2004
The way you put it Timo, it sounds like some ogre is coming to get you. (ROTFL)
Activation is NOT about invasion of your privacy. The serial number you enter to load the program generates a number set which needs a matching set of numbers before it will finish it’s task. It’s all Mathematics. You either send the numbers to Adobe who run a ‘key generator’ to provide the activation numbers or, you phone Adobe and provide the numbers.

If you don’t like Adobe doing the activation, get your own key generator off the Internet. Adobe activation is only one way to get a legally purchased product activated. No invasion of your privacy, no sending hardware specs and no hassle to re-install the software either.

Incidentally… Windows 9x has extreme memory limitations and will not therefore, work as well as 2k or XP Pro. That’s the only reason Adobe have dropped support for installing on 9x OS.

DM
——————–

"Timo Autiokari" wrote in message
I do so and will not upgrade the 9 systems I am responsible for to the CS due to the activation.

I own my house too and no service provider walks in through the front door using their own key. Instead they ring the bell and I open the door in case I choose to do so. The same policy is in effect with the network "door" also.

What comes to the security situation on the Internet today every communication software that you install will increase the probability of virus infection or total overtake of your system considerably. The risk is even much higher with hideous cryptic surveillance tools like the activation since these are difficult to manage, you do not know what they actually do. So when the activation code is infected by a virus or a backdoor trojan you (and your firewall) can only happily believe that it is the activation check going on and not that your password lists are being sent out.

I have no problems with the 98se and PS 7.0.1 the system works just similarly well as it did before the CS was published.

Timo Autiokari
T
toby
Feb 13, 2004
"Glenn" …
"Alberich" wrote in message
No more Photoshop or Illustrator and no more wishes for
InDesign either. I’ll have to switch over to Corel, Deneba, or Creature House if I want drawling tools I cand purchase with confidence and not worry about "activation". I wanted to buy Macromedia Freehand but when I heard they went the activation route…I kissed that product goodbye. Anybody out there thinking like me on this issue?

Yes, don’t purchase any professional level software, that will show them ! Don’t purchase Deep3D Paint or DeepUV, they have activation also … Oh 3DMax and ….. I really think that you are over reacting.

I would like to see *your* reaction when one of the following inevitably happens to your "Activated" product:

1. activation fails for any of the myriad technical reasons already discussed in threads like these – and you are prevented from using your big ticket purchase at all (this will occur at the worst possible moment, of course; I have read of cases where Office decides it requires reactivation – on a laptop on an aircraft, for example, from where it couldn’t be done. Goodbye productivity.)

2. your trustworthy software vendor decides to revoke your activation due to, for example, a new release. You may say this is far-fetched; you may reexamine this view when it happens to you, as it certainly will.

3. your trustworthy software vendor has business difficulties and closes its doors, or changes hands, or management, etc, resulting in its Activation servers, databases, being taken down, permanently. What do you think your chances of a refund are?

Sorry, I prefer the traditional license to run what I’ve bought whenever I want, thanks. Anything else is inevitably to the customer’s detriment.

T

Glenn
H
Hecate
Feb 13, 2004
On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 03:08:56 +0000 (UTC), "broga" <ian’@(remove to e-mail)micromountain.com> wrote:

So called regional dvd’s can be played on almost any computer – and simple dvd players are now so cheap you can buy one for almost the same price as a dvd, so just buy two for two different regions. I dont really want 2 players but if I can buy my discs cheaper outside the uk I might just do that

Go to Richer Sounds (there’ll be one near you, they’re all over the country). They have multi region DVD players for about £50 😉



Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
T
toby
Feb 13, 2004
"Tin Ear" …
"Alberich" wrote in message
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief …

I’m sick of these threads. Get over it! You buy / use a product because you feel it is the best tool for the job, because the company has worked to build a relationship with it’s users and because you know there is a community of support for it. Anything else. I fell, is immaterial.

What goes up, must come down; the relationship-building that Adobe has done over the past 20 years is being undone by customer-hostile measures such as "Activation". Why is it customer-hostile? The reasons have been enumerated time and again. It is not a credible anti-piracy measure; it is guaranteed to inconvenience legitimate purchasers to a small or large extent; and a lot of people are calling Adobe on it.

Noticed the increasingly cynical measures the market leaders are forced to apply to get people to upgrade? That’s one clear rationale for Activation – with that, they can simply make it mandatory to upgrade, if you want to keep using the software at all. Like shooting fish in a barrel.

You won’t start complaining about Activation until you’re the fish that just got shot.

The vendor is of course free to set any license terms they like. And a purchaser is bound to accept them if they want the product. But with this new kind of "sorta license, if it works, and we say so" the customer loses, and only Adobe wins. That’s a relationship I don’t care to enter into.

T
G
Glenn
Feb 13, 2004
"Toby Thain" wrote in message
"Glenn" wrote in message
news:…
"Alberich" wrote in message
No more Photoshop or Illustrator and no more wishes for
InDesign either. I’ll have to switch over to Corel, Deneba, or
Creature
House if I want drawling tools I cand purchase with confidence and not worry about "activation". I wanted to buy Macromedia Freehand but when
I
heard they went the activation route…I kissed that product goodbye. Anybody out there thinking like me on this issue?

Yes, don’t purchase any professional level software, that will show them
!
Don’t purchase Deep3D Paint or DeepUV, they have activation also … Oh 3DMax and ….. I really think that you are over reacting.

I would like to see *your* reaction when one of the following inevitably happens to your "Activated" product:
1. activation fails for any of the myriad technical reasons already discussed in threads like these – and you are prevented from using your big ticket purchase at all (this will occur at the worst possible moment, of course; I have read of cases where Office decides it requires reactivation – on a laptop on an aircraft, for example, from where it couldn’t be done. Goodbye productivity.)

2. your trustworthy software vendor decides to revoke your activation due to, for example, a new release. You may say this is far-fetched; you may reexamine this view when it happens to you, as it certainly will.

3. your trustworthy software vendor has business difficulties and closes its doors, or changes hands, or management, etc, resulting in its Activation servers, databases, being taken down, permanently. What do you think your chances of a refund are?

Sorry, I prefer the traditional license to run what I’ve bought whenever I want, thanks. Anything else is inevitably to the customer’s detriment.

T

Hardware and software protection has been around for a long time. Activation code is somewhat new. You can always speculate about some future events but the software industries history does not support your claims. Look at VisiCalc where you had to insert the original program disk to start the program every time, it was a lot better than using paper, pencil and an adding machine. That program caused the explosion in sells of Apple and PC’s and a lot of business deals and business plans where developed using a piece of software that could have failed because of a floppy disk read error.

I do agree that simple unrestricted licensing with no serial numbers and no protection would be easier, but that is just not a reality.

Glenn
TA
Timo Autiokari
Feb 13, 2004
"Douglas MacDonald" wrote:

The way you put it Timo, it sounds like some ogre is coming to get you. (ROTFL)
Activation is NOT about invasion of your privacy.

Well, that is the very same reason why Adobe offers the non-activation version of the CS for corporations. No IT manager accept such spyware on their machines.

The serial number you enter to load the program generates a number set which needs a matching set of numbers before it will finish it’s task. It’s all Mathematics. You either send the numbers to Adobe who run a ‘key generator’ to provide the activation numbers or, you phone Adobe and provide the numbers.

The activation code inspect your system, you just do not know how deeply it does it. And you do not know what info actually goes out. Looking from the ip-packets it is *far* more than just a serial number.

If you don’t like Adobe doing the activation, get your own key generator off the Internet. Adobe activation is only one way to get a legally purchased product activated. No invasion of your privacy, no sending hardware specs and no hassle to re-install the software either.

I just do not instal any activation products.

Ah, and there sure will be some hassle for those who "self-activate", as soon as the 0.1 upgrade arrives!

Incidentally… Windows 9x has extreme memory limitations and will not therefore, work as well as 2k or XP Pro. That’s the only reason Adobe have dropped support for installing on 9x OS.

How come these extreme memory limitations are not in effect with the
7.0.1.

Timo Autiokari
K
KBob
Feb 13, 2004
On 13 Feb 2004 00:59:37 -0800, (Toby Thain)
wrote:

"Tin Ear" …
"Alberich" wrote in message
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief …

I’m sick of these threads. Get over it! You buy / use a product because you feel it is the best tool for the job, because the company has worked to build a relationship with it’s users and because you know there is a community of support for it. Anything else. I fell, is immaterial.

What goes up, must come down; the relationship-building that Adobe has done over the past 20 years is being undone by customer-hostile measures such as "Activation". Why is it customer-hostile? The reasons have been enumerated time and again. It is not a credible anti-piracy measure; it is guaranteed to inconvenience legitimate purchasers to a small or large extent; and a lot of people are calling Adobe on it.
Noticed the increasingly cynical measures the market leaders are forced to apply to get people to upgrade? That’s one clear rationale for Activation – with that, they can simply make it mandatory to upgrade, if you want to keep using the software at all. Like shooting fish in a barrel.

You won’t start complaining about Activation until you’re the fish that just got shot.

The vendor is of course free to set any license terms they like. And a purchaser is bound to accept them if they want the product. But with this new kind of "sorta license, if it works, and we say so" the customer loses, and only Adobe wins. That’s a relationship I don’t care to enter into.

T

Since it should be clear to almost everyone that activation does nothing to thwart piracy, we need to consider what Adobe’s real motives are in doing this. It does seem likely that they are feeling out a workable method for implementing fee-based or subscription-based marketing. When you have a bunch of bean-counters (a.k.a. "bottom-line strategists") running the show as is the case with most large corporations, this is the sort of thing you might expect.
N
nospam
Feb 13, 2004
On 2004-02-11, Alberich wrote:
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. I won’t have to worry about spyware telling Adobe I’ve changed my video card adapter and having that company tell me it’s a "minor change’ that won’t "trigger" the activation mode. I won’t have to "cross" my fingers and praying the reinstallation of my LEGALLY purchased copy does’t give me the "no go" sign and be forced to explain to some tech support in God knows where and tell him/her why I’m doing what I’m doing.

Just download the activation crack, and store together with your original. Then you can always reinstall without activating.

I don’t see a huge problem.
L
llutton
Feb 13, 2004
Just because we’re paranoid doesn’t mean they’re not out to get us.
B
broga
Feb 13, 2004
veni, vidi, sumpsi


www.micromountain.com
"Hecate" wrote in message
On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 03:08:56 +0000 (UTC), "broga" <ian’@(remove to e-mail)micromountain.com> wrote:

So called regional dvd’s can be played on almost any computer – and
simple
dvd players are now so cheap you can buy one for almost the same price as
a
dvd, so just buy two for two different regions. I dont really want 2 players but if I can buy my discs cheaper outside the uk I might just do that

Go to Richer Sounds (there’ll be one near you, they’re all over the country). They have multi region DVD players for about
T
toby
Feb 14, 2004
"Povl H. Pedersen" …
On 2004-02-11, Alberich wrote:
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. …

Just download the activation crack, and store together with your original. Then you can always reinstall without activating.
I don’t see a huge problem.

* Would there be a problem if the crack didn’t exist?
* Can "pirates" use the crack too?
* Does Activation prevent piracy?
* Why is it used then?
* Who is more beneficial to the user community – the guy who decided Activation had to go in, or the guy who made the crack?
T

(CS = "Crack Smokers")
H
Hecate
Feb 14, 2004
On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 23:42:24 +0000 (UTC), "broga" <ian’@(remove to e-mail)micromountain.com> wrote:

veni, vidi, sumpsi

rideo clara voce! 😉



Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
H
Hecate
Feb 14, 2004
On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 18:24:46 +0000 (UTC), "Povl H. Pedersen" wrote:

On 2004-02-11, Alberich wrote:
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. I won’t have to worry about spyware telling Adobe I’ve changed my video card adapter and having that company tell me it’s a "minor change’ that won’t "trigger" the activation mode. I won’t have to "cross" my fingers and praying the reinstallation of my LEGALLY purchased copy does’t give me the "no go" sign and be forced to explain to some tech support in God knows where and tell him/her why I’m doing what I’m doing.

Just download the activation crack, and store together with your original. Then you can always reinstall without activating.
I don’t see a huge problem.

Except that cracking the software, which is what you are doing, is always illegal. End result is, you can tie yourself to Adobe and upgrade when they tell you, you can still use PS and become a criminal, or you can just find other software to do the job.



Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
T
toby
Feb 14, 2004
"Glenn" …
"Toby Thain" wrote in message
"Glenn" wrote in message
news:…
"Alberich" wrote in message
No more Photoshop or Illustrator and no more wishes for
InDesign either. I’ll have to switch over to Corel, Deneba, or
Creature
House if I want drawling tools I cand purchase with confidence and not worry about "activation". I wanted to buy Macromedia Freehand but when
I
heard they went the activation route…I kissed that product goodbye. Anybody out there thinking like me on this issue?

Yes, don’t purchase any professional level software, that will show them
!
Don’t purchase Deep3D Paint or DeepUV, they have activation also … Oh 3DMax and ….. I really think that you are over reacting.

I would like to see *your* reaction when one of the following inevitably happens to your "Activated" product:
1. activation fails for any of the myriad technical reasons already discussed in threads like these – and you are prevented from using your big ticket purchase at all (this will occur at the worst possible moment, of course; I have read of cases where Office decides it requires reactivation – on a laptop on an aircraft, for example, from where it couldn’t be done. Goodbye productivity.)

2. your trustworthy software vendor decides to revoke your activation due to, for example, a new release. You may say this is far-fetched; you may reexamine this view when it happens to you, as it certainly will.

3. your trustworthy software vendor has business difficulties and closes its doors, or changes hands, or management, etc, resulting in its Activation servers, databases, being taken down, permanently. What do you think your chances of a refund are?

Sorry, I prefer the traditional license to run what I’ve bought whenever I want, thanks. Anything else is inevitably to the customer’s detriment.

T

Hardware and software protection has been around for a long time. Activation code is somewhat new. You can always speculate about some future events but the software industries history does not support your claims. Look at VisiCalc where you had to insert the original program disk to start the program every time, it was a lot better than using paper, pencil and an adding machine. That program caused the explosion in sells of Apple and PC’s and a lot of business deals and business plans where developed using a piece of software that could have failed because of a floppy disk read error.
I do agree that simple unrestricted licensing with no serial numbers and no protection would be easier, but that is just not a reality.

In reality, draconian copy protection went out of vogue and almost completely disappeared due to various factors, one of the most significant being user inconvenience. Nor was it effective in preventing piracy. Activation is just the latest mercenary lock-in that is bad for the buyer, for all the reasons described and more. You’re welcome to it.
T

Glenn
N
nospam
Feb 14, 2004
On 2004-02-14, Toby Thain wrote:
"Povl H. Pedersen" …
On 2004-02-11, Alberich wrote:
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. …

Just download the activation crack, and store together with your original. Then you can always reinstall without activating.
I don’t see a huge problem.

* Would there be a problem if the crack didn’t exist?

Yes, I would say so. I buy a perpetual license, and Adobe writes a lot in their docs how they will release the activation software if they get in trouble. I feel better witht he crack in existance.

But I am a small personal home user, who is not making a single dollar off Photoshop, and who thinks they should make a non-CMYK capable version for home users with a different license. I managed to buy it for 1/3rd of list price, going though an eBay 6.0 + CS upgrade.

Adobe also says they will only activate twice every 6 months. This is probably not legal around here, but would be a problem if you upgrade you machine once, and runs into hardware problems. Then you can spend a couple activations in no time.

* Can "pirates" use the crack too?

Sure they can. And they do. I used the "Internet version" rather than the demo version to see if I should buy it.

* Does Activation prevent piracy?

Yes. In the first months after the product is out, the activation might not yet have a crack, thus resulting in more sales. Later on, it still prevents lots of the casual copying, which will probably not have resulted in many sold copies anyway.

And since the crack isn’t everywhere yet, some shops that used to copy it to all their workstations will buy more copies.

It is my guess Adobe makes money on it.

But it does not stop it completely.

* Why is it used then?

See above. Will help initial sales, and also some later sales. But advertizing agencies are pirates, and over time (i.e. 12 months after release), activation will not mean much anyway. So they should release a patch at that point of time.

* Who is more beneficial to the user community – the guy who decided Activation had to go in, or the guy who made the crack?

Since Adobe does not return any of the gains of using the Activation to the purchasers, the guy who made the crack might be better for users. Activation would be better for shareholders.
N
nospam
Feb 14, 2004
On 2004-02-14, Hecate wrote:
Just download the activation crack, and store together with your original. Then you can always reinstall without activating.
I don’t see a huge problem.

Except that cracking the software, which is what you are doing, is always illegal. End result is, you can tie yourself to Adobe and upgrade when they tell you, you can still use PS and become a criminal, or you can just find other software to do the job.

It might be illegal in the US. But if I do it to make the software compatible with a computer without Internet etc, then it is legal, and I may even pay someone to do reverse engineering and a fix for me. This is a right I can not give up according to the law.

compatible is the keyword though.

In reality, if I have a license for the software, they can’t prove any damages from my use of the crack, so they can not win any case in any court.
A
Alberich
Feb 15, 2004
In article ,
says…
On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 18:24:46 +0000 (UTC), "Povl H. Pedersen" wrote:

On 2004-02-11, Alberich wrote:
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. I won’t have to worry about spyware telling Adobe I’ve changed my video card adapter and having that company tell me it’s a "minor change’ that won’t "trigger" the activation mode. I won’t have to "cross" my fingers and praying the reinstallation of my LEGALLY purchased copy does’t give me the "no go" sign and be forced to explain to some tech support in God knows where and tell him/her why I’m doing what I’m doing.

Just download the activation crack, and store together with your original. Then you can always reinstall without activating.
I don’t see a huge problem.

Except that cracking the software, which is what you are doing, is always illegal. End result is, you can tie yourself to Adobe and upgrade when they tell you, you can still use PS and become a criminal, or you can just find other software to do the job.


Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui

How many photo editing tools out there allow type on a path like Photoshop CS? I’m glad I purchased Adobe Illustrator CS (no activation required on that software…yet) and I can type on a path and then export it as a work path to Photoshop 7.0. Problem solved. I’ll simply have to learn to live without all the advances Adobe will continue putting into Photoshop and continue using version 7.0. And that’s it. Period.

In my opinion…version 7.0 is Adobe’s swan song to loyal Photoshop users without resorting to the activation technology. It won’t be long now when Adobe will go even further…how about annual subscription models of Adobe products in the future? Activation is just one step away from that method and I have no intention of jumping onto that bandwagon. The party is over and I’m getting off the train before the ride gets even rougher.

I AM looking at cheaper alternatives than Photoshop right now. I’m carefully evaluating the benefits and drawbacks to CorelDraw 11 and 12. As to the contention that Adobe has nothing to worry about when it comes to "protecting" their lead in the graphic design field…I say to Adobe…look again. Jasc Paint Shop Pro 8 is fast on the rise…does many of the same things that Photoshop does for a fraction of the price. So it’s not "Photoshop". So what. AS long as it can do the things I’m asking for and looking at…I don’t care what name it’s called or where it’s from. AS long as that product doesn’t resort to activation technology…I’ll take a good look at that product. I personally don’t believe these companies are using activation to prevent piracy. The Intuit fiasco over TurboTax with activation technology proves it.

I’ve given up on Symantec products recently when I went to my local computer store and saw their entire line of products encorporating activation technology. Goodbye Symantec. Same thing with Macromedia products. These software giants simply don’t get it. It doesn’t pay to alienate loyal customers by treating them as potential criminals. I can do without the hassle. The alternative is to look for shareware plugins on the web that can do the same thing that these expensive activation crippleware versions do.
H
Hecate
Feb 15, 2004
On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 19:33:42 +0000 (UTC), "Povl H. Pedersen" wrote:

But I am a small personal home user, who is not making a single dollar off Photoshop, and who thinks they should make a non-CMYK capable version for home users with a different license.

They do. It’s called Photoshop Elements. And doesn’t require activation. Yet.

* Does Activation prevent piracy?

Yes. In the first months after the product is out, the activation might not yet have a crack, thus resulting in more sales. Later on, it still prevents lots of the casual copying, which will probably not have resulted in many sold copies anyway.

Wrong. The first crack for CS was out 2 days before Adobe officially released CS.

And since the crack isn’t everywhere yet, some shops that used to copy it to all their workstations will buy more copies.

Just enter Photoshop and crack into Google, see how many hits you get and then say i"It isn’t everywhere".

It is my guess Adobe makes money on it.

I doubt it. I think they’re going to lose money in the medium to long term because people will start looking for alternatives. I know I will.



Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
H
Hecate
Feb 15, 2004
On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 19:39:11 +0000 (UTC), "Povl H. Pedersen" wrote:

On 2004-02-14, Hecate wrote:
Just download the activation crack, and store together with your original. Then you can always reinstall without activating.
I don’t see a huge problem.

Except that cracking the software, which is what you are doing, is always illegal. End result is, you can tie yourself to Adobe and upgrade when they tell you, you can still use PS and become a criminal, or you can just find other software to do the job.

It might be illegal in the US. But if I do it to make the software compatible with a computer without Internet etc, then it is legal, and I may even pay someone to do reverse engineering and a fix for me. This is a right I can not give up according to the law.

I live in the UK, not the US, and cracking software is illegal in most countries. It’s a contractual offence, and thus civil, if you break the software licence, it becomes criminal and fraudulent if you then provide this software, or the crack to anyone else.

compatible is the keyword though.

In reality, if I have a license for the software, they can’t prove any damages from my use of the crack, so they can not win any case in any court.

Yes, they can, contractually.



Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
H
Hecate
Feb 15, 2004
On 14 Feb 2004 18:30:08 -0600, Alberich
wrote:

<snip>

I AM looking at cheaper alternatives than Photoshop right now. I’m carefully evaluating the benefits and drawbacks to CorelDraw 11 and 12.

Apart from the prepress stuff, Photopaint is excellent software.

<snip>

I’ve given up on Symantec products recently when I went to my local computer store and saw their entire line of products encorporating activation technology. Goodbye Symantec.

Me too. I’ve used NAV and System works, and before that NAV and Utils for years. Not any more.

Same thing with Macromedia
products.

That’s the one place where I don’t , at present, see an alternative. Dreamweaver is No.1 by a long way. The next best is Go Live, and whilst that isn’t "activated" yet, I’ve no doubt it will be. And life’s to short to go back to hand coding 😉

However, I am taking a look at NetObjects Fusion.

These software giants simply don’t get it. It doesn’t pay to alienate loyal customers by treating them as potential criminals. I can do without the hassle. The alternative is to look for shareware plugins on the web that can do the same thing that these expensive activation crippleware versions do.

Exactly.



Hecate

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T
Tom
Feb 15, 2004
"Hecate" wrote in message
On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 18:24:46 +0000 (UTC), "Povl H. Pedersen" wrote:

On 2004-02-11, Alberich wrote:
I’m glad I ran out and purchased the Photoshop 7 upgrade when I did. Because now I can breathe a sigh of relief and relax because I won’t have to worry about calling Adobe if my hard drive dies and I have to reinstall the application. I won’t have to worry about spyware telling Adobe I’ve changed my video card adapter and having that company tell
me
it’s a "minor change’ that won’t "trigger" the activation mode. I won’t have to "cross" my fingers and praying the reinstallation of my LEGALLY purchased copy does’t give me the "no go" sign and be forced to explain to some tech support in God knows where and tell him/her why I’m doing what I’m doing.

Just download the activation crack, and store together with your original. Then you can always reinstall without activating.
I don’t see a huge problem.

Except that cracking the software, which is what you are doing, is always illegal.

No, it is not "always illegal".

It has been pointed out to you numerous times that there is a big difference between breach of contract and theft but you continue to ignore it.

Tom
A
ausclicks
Feb 15, 2004
As usual you seem to be in your own quaintly different world again Hecate. Activation is done by generating an algorithm of compatible numbers. Use one set of number to get another set which are compatible. Nothing illegal about using a mathematical formula to create an activation code.

Buy the software, install it and when you are confronted with a set of activation number to send Adobe, enter them into a key generator (freely available off the ‘net) and generate your own activation code. What’s so hard about that? Nothing illegal, no software is "cracked". Just you providing the activation instead of Adobe.

DM
—————-

"Hecate" wrote in message
On 14 Feb 2004 18:30:08 -0600, Alberich
wrote:

<snip>
Hecate

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A
Alberich
Feb 15, 2004
In article ,
says…
On 14 Feb 2004 18:30:08 -0600, Alberich
wrote:

<snip>

I AM looking at cheaper alternatives than Photoshop right now. I’m carefully evaluating the benefits and drawbacks to CorelDraw 11 and 12.

Apart from the prepress stuff, Photopaint is excellent software.
<snip>

I’ve given up on Symantec products recently when I went to my local computer store and saw their entire line of products encorporating activation technology. Goodbye Symantec.

Me too. I’ve used NAV and System works, and before that NAV and Utils for years. Not any more.

Same thing with Macromedia
products.

That’s the one place where I don’t , at present, see an alternative.

I’m lucky I have legally purchased copies of Dreamweaver 4.0 and Flash
5.0 in my possession. I paid ALOT of money when these were released
years ago. Boy am I glad I won’t have to suffer activation problems with these reliable software products.

Dreamweaver is No.1 by a long way. The next best is Go Live, and whilst that isn’t "activated" yet, I’ve no doubt it will be. And life’s to short to go back to hand coding 😉

However, I am taking a look at NetObjects Fusion.

NetObjects Fusion is still around?! I’ll have to look at them. By the way…there should be a website up or created that WARNS users about which products are using activation technology. I have a suspicious feeling the word activation isn’t something that software vendors are going to put right up there for consumers to see right away. But this is asking for a class action lawsuit. In fact I see one coming if enough consumers complain they’re not warned beforehand that the products they buy "require" activation.
These software giants simply don’t get it. It doesn’t pay to alienate loyal customers by treating them as potential criminals. I can do without the hassle. The alternative is to look for shareware plugins on the web that can do the same thing that these expensive activation crippleware versions do.

Exactly.



Hecate

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1
123
Feb 15, 2004
Heres my own conspiracy theory: Adobe sells Photoshop at a price point which is only affordable by professionals and very well-off amatuers. Everbody else uses a pirate copy simply out of practical need, as they will never be able to afford to be a legal user. Piracy doesn’t really cost Adobe much at all because even if piracy was wiped out, these users still wouldn’t purchase the product. However the high price gives the product a perceived superiority and the illegal users actually deny customers to competitors with affordable products, hence reducing their ability to reinvest in development that may cut Adobe’s advantage. Should these illegal users ever become professional they will more than likely purchase the Photoshop product, as they are already skilled users. Adobe couldn’t possibly be so naive as to really believe *any* protection they added wouldn’t be broken in the short term, ergo the ‘Activation’ can really only be aimed at increasing control over legal users (piracy issues make for a convenient spin). Why? Limited duration licenses are getting serious consideration at Adobe as a money spinner.
-Deck
N
nospam
Feb 15, 2004
I use Photopaint frequently and find it much more intuitive and logical. There are some obvious things like Layer Styles that it doesn’t have :-(, but for daily meat and potatoes pixel work it’s a dream come true for me.

It’s the little things… If you were to save a PNG with an alpha channel from Discrete 3d Max 3/4, then open in both Corel PhotoPaint and the Photoshop 6, you can see that Photoshop’s implementation is screwed up, where it comes in as expected in PhotoPaint.

Not sure if you can resize nibs on the fly yet in PS… let alone in smooth increments.

JD

Apart from the prepress stuff, Photopaint is excellent software. – Hecate
H
Hecate
Feb 16, 2004
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 10:13:51 +1100, "D." wrote:

Heres my own conspiracy theory: Adobe sells Photoshop at a price point which is only affordable by professionals and very well-off amatuers. Everbody else uses a pirate copy simply out of practical need, as they will never be able to afford to be a legal user. Piracy doesn’t really cost Adobe much at all because even if piracy was wiped out, these users still wouldn’t purchase the product. However the high price gives the product a perceived superiority and the illegal users actually deny customers to competitors with affordable products, hence reducing their ability to reinvest in development that may cut Adobe’s advantage. Should these illegal users ever become professional they will more than likely purchase the Photoshop product, as they are already skilled users. Adobe couldn’t possibly be so naive as to really believe *any* protection they added wouldn’t be broken in the short term, ergo the ‘Activation’ can really only be aimed at increasing control over legal users (piracy issues make for a convenient spin). Why? Limited duration licenses are getting serious consideration at Adobe as a money spinner.
-Deck
Seems like a pretty logical argument to me and certainly worth thinking about. Personally, I wouldn’t put anything past the suits in control of major software companies.



Hecate

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H
Hecate
Feb 16, 2004
On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 04:08:38 GMT, "Douglas MacDonald" wrote:

As usual you seem to be in your own quaintly different world again Hecate. Activation is done by generating an algorithm of compatible numbers. Use one set of number to get another set which are compatible. Nothing illegal about using a mathematical formula to create an activation code.

I think you’ll find that doing so negates the terms of the EULA and as such will effectively break the licence.



Hecate

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H
Hecate
Feb 16, 2004
On 14 Feb 2004 23:07:09 -0600, Alberich
wrote:

However, I am taking a look at NetObjects Fusion.

NetObjects Fusion is still around?! I’ll have to look at them. By the way…there should be a website up or created that WARNS users about which products are using activation technology. I have a suspicious feeling the word activation isn’t something that software vendors are going to put right up there for consumers to see right away. But this is asking for a class action lawsuit. In fact I see one coming if enough consumers complain they’re not warned beforehand that the products they buy "require" activation.

Yes, I was surprised to, but it’s still around and looks quite good. I don’t know if it has the flexibility required these days though.

I hope they get enough lawsuits that it makes it worth their while not to carry on this ridiculous practice.



Hecate

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H
Hecate
Feb 16, 2004
On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 03:20:44 GMT, "Tom"
wrote:

Except that cracking the software, which is what you are doing, is always illegal.

No, it is not "always illegal".

It has been pointed out to you numerous times that there is a big difference between breach of contract and theft but you continue to ignore it.
Illegality is illegality whether you are breaking conditions of a licence or whether you are distributing hacked software. They may be different degrees of illegality, but they are still illegality. It’s just that one is civil law, the other criminal.



Hecate

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A
Alberich
Feb 16, 2004
In article , says…
Heres my own conspiracy theory: Adobe sells Photoshop at a price point which is only affordable by professionals and very well-off amatuers. Everbody else uses a pirate copy simply out of practical need, as they will never be able to afford to be a legal user. Piracy doesn’t really cost Adobe much at all because even if piracy was wiped out, these users still wouldn’t purchase the product. However the high price gives the product a perceived superiority and the illegal users actually deny customers to competitors with affordable products, hence reducing their ability to reinvest in development that may cut Adobe’s advantage. Should these illegal users ever become professional they will more than likely purchase the Photoshop product, as they are already skilled users. Adobe couldn’t possibly be so naive as to really believe *any* protection they added wouldn’t be broken in the short term, ergo the ‘Activation’ can really only be aimed at increasing control over legal users (piracy issues make for a convenient spin). Why? Limited duration licenses are getting serious consideration at Adobe as a money spinner.
-Deck
There you go. Just as I predicted. Subscription licenses. If that’s where we’re headed…I’m DEFINITELY getting off the train. Time to start shopping around for alternatives.
A
ausclicks
Feb 16, 2004
Sometimes I wonder about people.
DO you ever read instructions Hecate?
Have you read the EULA for PhotoShop CS yet?
DM
—————
"Hecate" wrote in message
On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 04:08:38 GMT, "Douglas MacDonald" wrote:

As usual you seem to be in your own quaintly different world again
Hecate.
Activation is done by generating an algorithm of compatible numbers. Use
one
set of number to get another set which are compatible. Nothing illegal
about
using a mathematical formula to create an activation code.

I think you’ll find that doing so negates the terms of the EULA and as such will effectively break the licence.



Hecate

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T
toby
Feb 16, 2004
Alberich …


How many photo editing tools out there allow type on a path like Photoshop CS? I’m glad I purchased Adobe Illustrator CS (no activation required on that software…yet) and I can type on a path and then export it as a work path to Photoshop 7.0. Problem solved. I’ll simply have to learn to live without all the advances Adobe will continue putting into Photoshop and continue using version 7.0. And that’s it. Period.

In my opinion…version 7.0 is Adobe’s swan song to loyal Photoshop users without resorting to the activation technology.

There are technical swansongs too. Illustrator 8.0 was the last version with "speed" and "reliability". T
N
nospam
Feb 16, 2004
On 2004-02-16, Douglas MacDonald wrote:
Sometimes I wonder about people.
DO you ever read instructions Hecate?
Have you read the EULA for PhotoShop CS yet?

In Denmark, intent is important. If you do it just to have your privacy, and not to copy the software, there is no
criminal intent, and thus you can’t be punished.

It is just a number after all
U
ued
Feb 19, 2004
I think the EU laws about the copyright and against piracy in software field consider illegal selling a pirated or counterfeit or a crack, and when the use is a lucrative one, and/or make damages to the owner of the copyright. This accepted, in an european court a legitimate software, purchased legally, installed with a crack system or adapted with a fake date, etc. will be (has already been) considered "not a fraud" because the damage is inconsistent. The proof of damage is always requested and prouved. I wish consider another aspect : sometime it happens to try different hardware elements in my computers: mainly graphic boards, storage systems, network adapter etc, meaning reinstalling OS. Every time Adobe will give me the new numbers to activate PSCS? Also twice or more a day? for a week?and a month?
I had my problems with the Windows XP activation service, fighting by phone with the operators every time for one month or so (Now they know I do it professionally and joke with me).
I’ll never admit sometime to use an universal code.

ued

"Hecate" wrote in message
On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 19:39:11 +0000 (UTC), "Povl H. Pedersen" wrote:

On 2004-02-14, Hecate wrote:
Just download the activation crack, and store together with your original. Then you can always reinstall without activating.
I don’t see a huge problem.

Except that cracking the software, which is what you are doing, is always illegal. End result is, you can tie yourself to Adobe and upgrade when they tell you, you can still use PS and become a criminal, or you can just find other software to do the job.

It might be illegal in the US. But if I do it to make the software compatible with a computer without Internet etc, then it is legal, and I may even pay someone to do reverse engineering and a fix for me. This is a right I can not give up according to the law.

I live in the UK, not the US, and cracking software is illegal in most countries. It’s a contractual offence, and thus civil, if you break the software licence, it becomes criminal and fraudulent if you then provide this software, or the crack to anyone else.

compatible is the keyword though.

In reality, if I have a license for the software, they can’t prove any damages from my use of the crack, so they can not win any case in any court.

Yes, they can, contractually.



Hecate

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U
ued
Feb 19, 2004
A fundamentalist ?

ued

"Hecate" wrote in message
On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 03:20:44 GMT, "Tom"
wrote:

Except that cracking the software, which is what you are doing, is always illegal.

No, it is not "always illegal".

It has been pointed out to you numerous times that there is a big difference between breach of contract and theft but you continue to
ignore
it.
Illegality is illegality whether you are breaking conditions of a licence or whether you are distributing hacked software. They may be different degrees of illegality, but they are still illegality. It’s just that one is civil law, the other criminal.



Hecate

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H
Hecate
Feb 19, 2004
On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 02:23:26 +0100, "ued"
wrote:

A fundamentalist ?
Just someone who is [pissed off with the constant misuse of language 🙂



Hecate

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R
RTM
Feb 19, 2004
Alberich wrote in message
How many photo editing tools out there allow type on a path like Photoshop CS?

Paintshop Pro 8 does (I know you mentioned that further down in your post). So did PSP 7.
If you want to do it in one prog and export to another then Corel does it too. The PhotoTools add-on for Photoshop also does it, I’ve been using that in PS5.5 for a few years now. Text on a path isn’t anything special anymore.

I’m against activation, and I think it can safely be said that with the way other programs are progressing, Photoshop isn’t quite the ‘must have’ tool it used to be. There will always be the die-hards that think so. That is for them to deal with.
I reckon I got my last Adobe product when I got PS5.5. Anything since then has just been ‘cashing-in’ on Adobe’s part. I can buy a new full version of PaintShop for less than the price of a PS upgrade so if Adobe wants my money they are really going to have to pull something special out of the hat AFTER they dump activation!


Ron.

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