PS CS: Should MSVCRT.DLL & SHFOLDER.DLL be in root directory?

Hello All,

I'm about to reinstall PS CS in an effort to isolate what is causing PS CS to suddenly close when selecting Help (sometimes, not always). Deleting my preferences and removing all 3rd-party plug-ins has made no difference. Now, looking at the root Photoshop CS directory, I see that all files are dated in 2003 except for the following two files:

MSVCRT.DLL version 6.0.8397.0 dated 2/2/1999
SHFOLDER.DLL version 5.50.4027.300 dated 12/3/1999

A search of my system partition only (C:) shows that I have 18 instances and multiple versions of MSVCRT.DLL in various program directories, with the most current being 7.0.2600.1106 dated 8/29/2002 in my WINDOWS/SYSTEM32 directory. Given that location, I'd expect that file to be overriding the use of the others, unless an application looks first at its own directory before going to to the system files.

Similarly, for SHFOLDER.DLL, I find 3 instances with version 6.0.2800.1106 dated 8/29/2002 being the most current.

So, could some PS CS user inspect their PS CS root directory and tell me if they see the same thing? Meanwhile, I'm going to replace the 2 files with the 2 current versions to see what happens.

Thanks,

Daryl

Never mind...swapping out current versions of the above mentioned files made no difference. For that matter, it seems I don't even need an image open. Just selecting the Help menu gives the R6025 virtual function call error. Time to reinstall PS CS.

And here's a final update for the night...PS CS was removed via the Standard Uninstall. System rebooted and PS CS reinstalled after first disabling Norton Antivirus and Personal Firewall, plus a few other TSRs. System rebooted again although not said to be necessary. PS CS started up with no plug-ins installed, no preferences changed from default other than Adobe RGB selection in color settings, no images opened. Welcome Screen disabled. Select Photoshop Help, Help displayed OK. Close PS Help and reselect, OK. Close PS Help and reselect...PS CS shuts down abruptly. When re-opened, behavior is as if a fresh install with Welcome Screen displayed, color settings lost. Of course, with an abnormal exit that is to be expected.

Next, PS was reopened and preferences for RAM, Scratch Disks, and Color Settings were set. Then PS closed so as to save current preferences. Once Adobe License Manager service had closed down, PS was restarted. At this point, 10 consecutive attempts to open and close PS Help were successfully done. Moving to the Open command, an error was reported of "Could not complete the Open command because of a program error." Same for New command.

I can think of nothing that I have done since first installing PS CS a week ago that would introduce such problems as these. I am aware of one WinXP critical update that was performed during that time. While I use Norton SystemWorks 2003, Norton Protection is disabled and only Anti-Virus and Personal Firewall remain active. I have an Epson 1270 printer connected but it has not been powered on during any of this, nor have either my Epson 2450 Photo Scaner or Nikon LS-2000. So, I cannot think of any external devices that would be interacting with PS CS to possibly serve as a problem source.

My system is an older hardware configuration that has been extremely stable under WinXP, inclusive of use with PS7. Motherboard is SuperMicro P6DGU with dual 550MHz P3 CPUs and 1.5GB PC100 RAM. System Info is already listed in YrbkMgr "PS CS: (Problem Duplicated!) Help Menu = Close Photoshop?" 11/16/03 2:30am </cgi-bin/webx?13/5>.

If any suggestions can be offered on what to explore next, I welcome hearing them.

My only thought, and I don't think this is very likely, is whether or not there is anything about the Activation process that by the fact PS CS is not yet activated, it could actually introduce problems?

Thanks,

Daryl

Daryl,

CS is beyond my knowledge, but is Help in CS also facilitated through Internet Explorer like PS7? Does your PS also shuts down if you open an instance of IE? Pardon me, but did you delete the scratch volume that CS created and couldn't wipe because of abnormal shutdown? (many volumes in the mean time / disk space?)
What's in the Task Manager after sucessfully opening help? What's in the Task Manager right after abnormal shutdown?

I have both files scattered over my HD, but only SHFOLDER.DLL is in my PS directory. (W2K SP3, PS7.01)

Rob

both those files are operating system files and change with almost every version of the os and many products.

search here for windows dll's and versions and what ver shipped with what product:

MS DLL Help Database < http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=/servicedesks /fileversion/dllinfo.asp&SD=MSDN&FR=0>

be cautioned, trying to track down a misversioned MS dll can lead to chaos and madness!

Hi Rob,

Thanks...good questions all. Yes, PS CS Help still uses IE and opening IE6 independently has no impact upon PS CS. I'll go back tonight and remove that last security patch to see if it affected anything. I don't recall if it was installed before or after the first instance of my seeing this problem last week.

Although I do keep the the scratch disk area clean as I go through this troubleshooting, it isn't always needed after these aborts. If no image has been opened yet and all I've done is exercise PS CS Help, there is no PS scratch file created.

What I just observed was a PS CS abort on the 2nd attempt of selecting PS CS Help, but with PS CS Help also still open. The process transitions in Task Manager looked normal (refer to <http://jazzdiver.com/photoshop/ps8/pscs_fail.gif> ). With PS CS initially open, I captured a snap of Task Manager. Opening PS Help, the only new process, as expected, was for Internet Explorer. Following the abort of PS CS when PS Help selected again, the processes that cleared out were Photoshop, the Adobe License Manager, and the two Macrovision temporary processes.

Dave,

Indeed, I may go mad trying to sort this out. I knew MSVCRT.DLL is used and changed quite often but SHFOLDER.DLL was a new one to me. I doubt I could track down a misversioned DLL, but fortunately this one check of file dates in the root PS CS folder at least steered me into considering they might be the problem source.

Hmmmm...just realizing that after uninstalling PS CS last night that I didn't double-check the root directory to be sure it was fully cleaned out and deleted (questioning if the two DLLs were removed), I looked at it just now. Although I never installed anything that would have created the two DLLs in the PS CS folder, I decided to simply remove them since I did see they were still there after the reinstall. That is, whether they were uninstalled and reinstalled with PS CS, I don't know. But, with them removed, I just now successfully opened and closed PS CS Help a dozen times, along with exercising New and Open a few times. No problems were noted.

I'll return tonight to see if this holds true. Could the chaos and madness be ending?

If the Adobe folk read this, I sure hope they can shed some light.

Thanks guys,

Daryl

Chris or Scott, hoping you see this...although I've yet to have a chance to more exhaustively verify it, can you suggest any reason why removal of MSVCRT.DLL and SHFOLDER.DLL from the PS CS root directory might prevent PS CS from aborting with attempts to access PS Help?

Thanks,

Daryl

Daryl,

just checking, the versions I have in C:\Program Files\Adobe\Photoshop CS are:

msvcrt.dll:
Version: 6.0.8397.0
Size: 260 KB (266,293 bytes)
Modified: Tuesday, February 02, 1999, 12:00:00 AM

SHFOLDER.DLL:
Version: 5.50.4027.300
Size: 22.2 KB (22,800 bytes)
Modified: Friday, December 03, 1999, 6:01:32 AM

dave

Thanks for the confirmation Dave...as expected, your versions are the same. I'm heading home so I'll soon be fighting the PS war again. If and when I get this problem resolved I think any issue I have with having to activate will seem rather petty. You know, one thing did come to mind about activation...I wonder if software that isn't activated is any easier to get a refund on? I expect not, since that might encourage piracy.

Daryl

Too many late nights messing around trying to figure out what is wrong with Photoshop CS....nothing was different tonight with MSVCRT.DLL and SHFOLDER.DLL removed. The installation is clean, still with no plug-ins installed, no Norton utilities of any sort running, nothing that should interfere. I still observed an abort, so I restored the files and continued exploring the problem. When it seemed Help was opening OK via use of the F1 key, I became suspicious of my mouse (MS Bluetooth Intellimouse) since I'd been using it for menu access to Help, Open, New, etc., but the driver is current. Later, an abort occurred even using F1, so I checked my MS Natural Multimedia keyboard...an outdated driver was updated with no benefit. I switched to my Wacom tablet...still aborts occurred. The only thing seemingly improved was one case (using F1) took 40-50 attempts at opening and closing PS Help before the abort. Along the way, there was another instance of selecting Open resulting in a error of something to the effect of "This command could not be performed due to a program error." Upon closing the error dialog, I couldn't even select Exit without the same result. I had to abort PS CS via the Task Manager.

I'm nearly at my wits end on this save for the idea of doing a clean reinstall from a wiped drive, which shouldn't be required on a WinXP system that has been EXTREMELY STABLE ever since the XP upgrade 2 years or so ago. Yes, there are some old components (Ultra TNT2 graphics card for example), but nothing out of the ordinary. One may easily claim its my system and not Photoshop, but I'd nearly have to say "prove it". I know there are many variables, and it could well be my system, but I just don't believe that. I'd sure welcome some suggestions that stop short of a reinstallation of all software.

In fact, being glad I've not yet activated, I may just sell PS7 to someone and transfer my license to them...I'm not sure how that's done for an upgrade although I'd of course have to be certain the buyer had PS7 or earlier. I've already registered PS CS but perhaps not being activated yet would at least make the process a little easier if I pursue it. Heck, I'd return it to Amazon if possible and if I hadn't thrown away the box.

Playing off all this talk about the activation crack, I can only say "Why crack what's already broken?"

If anyone cares to see one flavor of this failure occur, I've got a full-screen 1280x1024 AVI capture of it at a slow 1 fps rate. The file is a 2.2MB download. In this, I open PSCS and first move my Action palette to prepare it for use for an Open/Close test action that I never get around to running. I then go to the Help menu a few times and open/close Photoshop Help without any problem and then switch over to using F1 so I can more quickly exercise the open/close of PS Help. The speed of the open/close isn't the source of the problem, believe me...this is done purely for the sake of keeping the video short. Before long, the abort occurs. Task Manager is open alongside this showing how what process changes are going on.

The file is at <http://jazzdiver.com/photoshop/ps8/ps8failure.avi>.

I feel like Charlie Brown...waiting for someone to just say "Good Grief!"

Daryl

So, I can't get to the movie (our nicer firewall is down), and I can't seem to repro the problem. I was able to F1 - Alt F4 a whole lotta times (more than 25) without a problem. Any other hints so I can reproduce the issue?

-Scott

Hello Scott,

Thanks for the attention on this. The movie was mostly just to illustrate the reality of this problem. Whether you'd learn anything from it or not, I'm not sure. But, as for other hints, I'm at a loss to know what to suggest.

As I mentioned, after realizing I was always using the mouse to access the menu, I thought I'd try the F1 key instead. That really led me to think I was onto something until maybe the 40th try or so killed PS CS. I uninstalled my 2 most recent WinXP security updates, but the 1 for IE6 SP1 did not provide an installer, so I was stuck with leaving it intact. Those 3 updates were the only software mods since Nov. 12 when I installed PS CS.

I've not exercised all Help menu options to see if it is only the Photoshop Help that is the culprit there, but if so that would suggest some problem tied-in with IE6. In fact, that gives me an idea now to change my default browser to Netscape and see if that affects things. I'll update my results late tonight in this thread.

As I recall, the error with PS closing abruptly has always been triggered by accessing PS Help. For the 4 or 5 days that I spent developing PhotoBars, I never saw the frequency of errors as I am now, but there was the 1 instance of an abort when using PS Help. The R6025 error and other errors that seem more related to other menu commands such as Open, New, etc., are more random and difficult to pin down but did not arise during any of the PhotoBars development time. Actually, they didn't seem to appear until I began exhaustively trying to duplicate the Help/Abort problem.

I brought in PS CS today and temporarily installed it on a Win2K machine at work. I opened and closed PS Help about 100 times without a problem. A few accesses of File menu comands seemed functional as well. While only a brief test, I'm leaning toward this being a WinXP-based problem. And maybe it is truly unique to something about my system.

I know there are limits on how much time you can spend trying to duplicate this and I'd not be too surprised if it is a small number of users affected. To be the only user affected would seem rare though. I'm hoping Mike Flood's encounter with the R6025 error is related.

Anything more I learn, I'll pass along. Thanks again for the help.

Daryl

Scott,

I changed my XP default browser to Netscape 7.0 and there was no change in PS CS working any better. Two cases were: 1) Opened PS Help numerous times (15-20) with no ill effects, then chose File > Open and received "Could not perform the Open command because of a program error". File Browser still worked until selecting a file to open through it, Silverfast Import worked, File > New failed. PS closed and reopened. 2) Continuosly opened PS Help until failure obtained with program abort after perhaps 40 open/close attempts.

I'm going to go ahead and install PS CS to my laptop which has WinXP also, and see if there are any problems. I don't know what my next step will be with my desktop, but wiping it and restoring a basic system image to rebuild from may be my only choice...and a chore to put off until the weekend.

Regards,

Daryl

Hi - I am in the same club. My PSCS vaporizes after loading a medium PS file from the browser, then trying to save as a different name. I don't even switch to an external program!!

So, after much trouble and tribulation, one of the last trouble shooting tips prior to getting to the "format the harddrive" which would have gotten me back to PS 7.01 was to create a new account. I was pretty skeptical!! But lo and behold PSCS no longer crashes!! Of course, I figure that Adobe owes me about 600 bucks for the 5 hours of work it took to do this!!

Chris

How do you figure Adobe owes you for a corrupt hard drive or OS on your system?

Hello All,

After a weekend spent wiping my hard drive and reinstalling all software and hardware along with the appropriate updates to ensure everything is current (all WinXP updates, latest h/w drivers, etc.), I can now report that reinstalling PS CS on this clean system was...useless. Well, not entirely so, as I feel this points more and more toward problems in PS CS.

Before installing PS CS, I made a system image so that I could restore everything intact without PS CS or its activation records. This now gives me the flexibility of switching between the current system build and a lesser, basic system build (WinXP plus h/w, but no additional s/w installed) for comparison, and that will be my next step, so as to try and narrow down the problem to being something about my system rather than PS CS. I think I can predict what I'll be doing for Thanksgiving.

My observations following a clean system rebuild, installation of most software apps (Office XP, OmniPage Pro, Norton Anti-virus & utilities, etc., etc.), and finally a PS CS installation are:

1. PS CS opened and ran my old PS6 Test Action (from <http://jazzdiver.com/photoshop/pc_test.htm)> just fine. That action exercises Lighting Effects, Find Edges, Brightness/Contrast, Palette Knife, Fade, Extrude, and Image Size, as well as a BMP save and close). Performance was significantly slower in contrast to PS7, but otherwise no errors arose.

2. Exercising the selection and closing of Photoshop Help, 5 times first via the menu and then a several times using F1, but always closing just by clicking the "X", PS CS eventually reported an R6025 Error...pure virtual function call. Once that occurred, the New and Open commands failed to be executed "...due to a program error." No surprise here, since R6025 had occurred.

3. Closing PS CS and reopening it after a clearing of preferences, the very first attempt to open PS Help did something different...nothing at all. Proceeding to "Open" only provided the "...due to a program error" response. I closed PS CS manually rather than waiting for it to abort.

4. Re-opening PS CS, the first attempt to open PS Help was successful. Deciding to go ahead and run a video capture of my actions on screen, I started Camtasia and then proceeded to select PS Help again. Conveniently for the capture, the very next attempt at selecting PS Help resulted in the same error as before, with PS Help not being launched in Internet Explorer, and with errors reported and an abort occurring as I proceeded with attempting to select New and Open.

So, with the problems still occurring on this clean system, I maintain for now that Photoshop has some bug that has yet to be duplicated by others. However, that same point also suggests my system is at fault. The next step I will take is to restore a system image that was created after installing WinXP and getting all hardware devices in working order. That is, with no other superfluous software installed, I'll install PS CS and see what happens. I'm hopeful the problem will still exist, otherwise it will suggest a software conflict that will be more difficult to isolate, necessitating PS CS be opened and tested after every additional application that I install. So, skipping that, I'll next consider the hardware and disable all but the essential hardware in Device Manager to see what happens then.

Suggestions? Ideas? Different troubleshooting approach? I welcome whatever help or advice can be offered.

The hardware configuration of my system can be found at <http://jazzdiver.com/photoshop/ps8/pc_hw.txt>

The screen capture is a 1.68MB download at 1024x768 resolution and 1fps for 15 seconds. The file can be found at <http://jazzdiver.com/photoshop/ps8/ps8fail2.avi>

Thanks,

Daryl