To whom it may concern

F
Posted By
Freeagent
Dec 17, 2008
Views
436
Replies
25
Status
Closed
Recently I posted in a couple of threads here that had subjects that interested me. I don’t do that often, because I’m a Windows user and spend most of my time in the Win forum. But why not? The Win forum has several regular contributors that happen to use Macs, and we don’t think twice about it. They’re as welcome as anyone else, and their opinions as valued as anyone else’s, not more, not less. And lots of issues are platform indifferent.

But not so here. It didn’t take long before the skeletons came tumbling out of the closet. A few choice quotes:

Please don’t keep referring to Windows, which is retarded at best and not color managed in any real sense unless you force it. No one here cares

What I fail to understand is why Windoz users come to a Mac forum. You don’t see Mac users in a Windoz forum… That pretty much says it all you know. It’s like you come over here and try to get us to change our opinions of your OS. Why?

I do read the Windows Photoshop Forum postings from time to time and notice that that the general level of technical knowledge and ability seems to be at a far lower level there than it is here

And my personal favorite:

I have had PC’s forever. I probably know more about them than most PC users. I still have no reason to frequent windoz forums

There’s no point in me trying to comment on any of those statements. I wouldn’t know where to start. The sheer ignorance, the boundless arrogance masquerading as "authority", the superior attitude. It really makes my hair stand on end.

Ever wonder why things tend to get ugly here, and why you need that big red warning on top of the page? It’s not because of the Jim Jordans. All he does is to poke at some people’s arrogance.

This forum is not a good place to be for anyone but the inner clique that runs things around here. All others are quickly told their place, or run out of town.

Oh, and one more thing: Some will probably make a big deal out of my "anonymity", as if that somehow invalidates what I say. This may surprise you, Lundberg, RamΓ³n, Ann, Cindy and others, but your names mean nothing to me. You could sign in with any random sequence of letters, and I couldn’t care less. I care about what you say.

I know you probably don’t give a ”” *** what I think, so you don’t have to waste breath telling me that. In any case I’m not going anywhere near this place again, ever.

I know a handful of Mac users with a broader mind who rise above all this. You’ll find them over in the Windows forum. They have my deepest respect, even more so knowing where they come from, namely this place.

Must-have mockup pack for every graphic designer πŸ”₯πŸ”₯πŸ”₯

Easy-to-use drag-n-drop Photoshop scene creator with more than 2800 items.

JJ
John Joslin
Dec 17, 2008
That needed saying.

It’s interesting to note the almost palpable air of superiority with which some of the hard-core regulars in here look down on people from the other side.

These people don’t produce better work; their minority operating system is bedevilled with multiple versions which may or may not work with some versions of Photoshop; apparently they have to go through some cleansing ritual before and after installing software, but still they carry on addressing Windows users as if they were some lower form of existence.

Wake up guys! Your OS is no longer the "only choice" for artists, designers and photographers. Take a daring leap into the 21st century and treat your fellow users like equals.
WZ
Wade_Zimmerman
Dec 17, 2008
The choice of platform is irrelevant when you are having problems unless they are platform related.

And there is no reason to get strange about responding to a request for assistance. I t would be very cool if the user trying to assist would simply refrain if they feel they were out of sync for their lack of knowledge of the system in question because of keyboard or other out of sync technical differences and let those users that feel they can help assist instead.

It would be fine I think if many of the regulars restrain from dictating who and what are legitimate posters and let some new breathe breath freer air.

If it really is a platform issue it is good to point that out to the user as some often wander here by accident. It use to be done in a very polite way but it seems to have turned seriously wrong in the last few years.

Good luck with your effort at correcting the issue but I think you might want to reword your post so as not to seem as if you were drawn into a situation where you are not really presenting your point of view but rather trying to score a point back even if it is natural to do so.
JJ
Jim_Jordan
Dec 17, 2008
Freeagent, I thought Cindy’s post about ‘technical knowledge’ was intended as a joke. Last week or so I was trying to convey to her how to run MSIE through Wine on her Mac. She was hopeless in regard to knowing how her Mac works. I’ve seen her need plenty of other help in this forum as well. I’m sure she would be the first to admit she is no Mac guru. There is clearly a joke being communicated when both Cindy and Ramon insult ‘Windoze’. They both use Windows! She can’t seriously mean anything by her mention of ‘opinions of your OS’ when Windows is clearly her OS as well.

It would be fine I think if many of the regulars restrain from dictating who and what are legitimate posters

Wade, exclusion has been the M.O. for Ann, Ramon and Buko for some time. Although there may be a few more that try to exclude their fellow posters here, those exclusionary folks are a very small minority. So why do the rest of us (the clear majority) allow this? This thread indicates many of us are watching but not doing anything. If you see one of these exclusionary posters being malicious to a new poster, step in, welcome the poster, and give aid to their question. There’s no better way for the majority of us to turn the table and exclude these very few but very loud exclusionary posters.
JJ
John Joslin
Dec 17, 2008
That is NOT the answer!

Don’t be confrontational!
JJ
Jim_Jordan
Dec 17, 2008
John, what is not the answer?

Are you saying we should not step in, welcome the poster, and give aid to their question? I see no recommendation in the past few posts to be confrontational.
JJ
Jim_Jordan
Dec 17, 2008
A demonstration of the action we can take as noted in post #3 can be seen here:

<http://www.adobeforums.com/webx?128@@.59b747d9>

For a few hours, a new poster was left alone with Ramon’s malice. That malice was starting to contaminate the new poster’s replies and bad things started to brew.

So other posters step in, explain the nature of certain regular posters that should be avoided and then answer the OP’s question. Further, options are offered to the OP should they feel they need to report the malicious posts. What is confrontational about that?
WZ
Wade_Zimmerman
Dec 17, 2008
Your link leads the forums home page.
JJ
Jim_Jordan
Dec 17, 2008
Ah – it looks like the OP actually followed through with the info about reporting malicious posts or the forum host/operations has become aware of recent posts. The other thread has been vaporized. I see at least one more of Ramon’s special threads is missing as well.
R
Ram
Dec 17, 2008
I repeat, with emphasis added:

It was my misfortune to be forced to work on PC and Windoze machines under Messy-DOS and Windoze for almost two decades during my day job with Uncle Sam until I could no longer work. My disrespect and hatred of those systems has been thoroughly, earnestly and honestly earned.

It’s not surprising that my hatred for those operating systems I so despise shows through, and I make no apologies for that whatsoever.

Nor can I remotely promise that this will not continue to be the case. It would be like expecting a Holocaust survivor to show respect for the Nazis.

An entirely different thing would be showing disrespect for users of any system, like others do when referring to Mac users.

You and all other Windoze users have my complete respect and symphaty, not for being Windozers but for being persons, fellow human beings. I sincerely hope and believe that you do not define your identity by the machines you use, whether computer or cars.
MR
Mark_Reynolds
Dec 17, 2008
A bit Tasteless isn’t it to compare race issues with this – Can’t you CHOOSE whether or not you use a mac? macs are still bafflingly in the minority despite their Operating system, reliability, usability, virus safety, and speed advantages.
R
Ram
Dec 17, 2008
macs are still bafflingly in the minority

Not when it comes to photography and the graphics industry. According to Microsoft’s numbers, the market is divided roughly 60%Β—40% "either way", which makes it effectively roughly 50-50.

to compare race issues

Where do you get "race" from? Must be a comment related to that youtube link, which I skipped. I see you edited your post while I was typing. Never mind that.

Can’t you CHOOSE whether or not you use a mac?

Not when you’re working for Uncle Sam. 😐
MR
Mark_Reynolds
Dec 17, 2008
I bet there are a fair few IT professionals making a fortune out of Uncle Sam then, same as they do in United Kingdom. Hope these people all have a plan B career, maybe their plan is a sobotage Apple plan. Just a theory.
JJ
Jim_Jordan
Dec 17, 2008
Can’t you CHOOSE whether or not you use a mac?

Not when you’re working for Uncle Sam.

But Ramon CHOSE to buy a Windows Vista laptop this year (long after working for Uncle Sam) and a few posts in the Adobe forums indicate he was pleased with his Windows purchase. Whether Ramon wants to try to define/discern hating ‘Windows’ vs. hating ‘Windows users’, any hatred is absurd if Ramon willingly purchases Windows.
JJ
John Joslin
Dec 17, 2008
<sigh>
R
Ram
Dec 17, 2008
Of course, there are certain Windozers that make it very easy for us to despise them as individuals, but not because they’re ‘dozers, but because they’re subhuman. πŸ˜€
B
Buko
Dec 17, 2008
Hey Free,

You stay around here, you are welcome and don’t let anyone scare you off. The only person not welcome is jim (the A-hole) Jordan, he started to behave but he is slipping back to his old ways.

Lately I’ve been hanging out in your neck of the woods I personally think its a good idea to see what the other platform is doing. Not everyone is friendly on your side of the hallway either. You can’t let a few people sour you on the Mac forum.

JJ has added quite a bit to the Mac side a slightly different perspective is a good thing.

So stick around Free You are very welcome here.
JJ
Jim_Jordan
Dec 17, 2008
Ramon, for clarity, previous posts in this thread note that your continual criticism of Windows is out of place as you have willingly purchased Windows. No one here has called you ‘subhuman’ or made any other insult to you personally. So take your personal issues and insults elsewhere. Your bad attitude is unwanted, even if you think it is funny.

Buko knows how to get the attention of John Cornicello.
AS
Ann_Shelbourne
Dec 17, 2008
The problem, as I see it, is that a bunch of Windows-users seem to make a point of coming over to the Mac Forum with the deliberate and sole intention of stirring-up dissent and trouble here.

Then they berate us for not wishing to participate in the Windows Forum.

I have looked in at that Forum and found that most of their contributors have little understanding of, or real interest in, Photoshop; and spend most of their time complaining about their hardware and Operating System. Neither do I find the discussions intellectually stimulating or challenging.

That is why I do not choose to participate in their Forum.

However, I do wonder why the denizens of that place find it necessary to come over to this Forum when they obviously find themselves so out-of-tune with its culture.

Perhaps we are Elitists over here but our superior equipment gives us much to be elitist about!

πŸ™‚
B
Buko
Dec 17, 2008
Well the way I see it Jim is the truly disruptive Windows user. I have no problem with the others.
JM
J_Maloney
Dec 17, 2008
No one here has called you ‘subhuman’ or made any other insult to you personally.

O RLY?

< http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=11BVqAGjO3carsoL6K N3RiYJIptj31>
C
Cindy
Dec 17, 2008
Perhaps we are Elitists over here but our superior equipment gives us much to be elitist about!

You go Ann. πŸ™‚
JJ
Jim_Jordan
Dec 17, 2008
No Windows user has come to this forum to stir up trouble. Why would they bother?

No Windows user has come to this forum to sell Windows. <http://www.adobeforums.com/webx?14@@.59b6ba1a/15>

No one is berating you for not participating in the Windows forum.

J, why don’t you post the thread link where that came from? You obviously doctored it.
R
Ram
Dec 17, 2008
The problemΒ…

The problem is theirs, meaning it’s a problem only for those that choose to make it a problem.

There’s a monumental silliness in feeling upset about criticism of a damned machine or OS.

Who cares whether I or others despise anything? I happen to dislike cats intensely, so what?
JC
John_Cornicello
Dec 17, 2008
<sigh> is right. Time to take it outside.

MacBook Pro 16” Mockups πŸ”₯

– in 4 materials (clay versions included)

– 12 scenes

– 48 MacBook Pro 16″ mockups

– 6000 x 4500 px

Related Discussion Topics

Nice and short text about related topics in discussion sections