Could this be because there is a non-transparent background layer in the image to which you pasted it?
I’ll double check – be back in a mo’
The effect is replicable
You are quite correct in the sense that the File > New does indeed create a background layer.
However, switching off the background layer gives no significant difference to the side-by-side images posted.
Copying and pasting seems to block translucency.
It may go some way towards explaining the original effect I was trying to show.
That was:
1 – a layer has brushed in translucent patches as a consequence of the brush chosen (Pastel on Charcoal Paper if I remember well)
2 – duplicating the layer (well CTRL + J several, 3 or 4 times) fills in the translucent patches but also introduces banding at the same time
It’s not the end of the world 🙂 but it was a pair of surprising results.
Maybe the effect can be replicated?
I’ve tried a couple of time on this machine and the observations made are consistent but -hey- that may be local to this computer?
First, as a test, make sure that your source layer is at 100% opacity.
Then create a new image with a transparent background and paste. Is there still the translucency?
Hi Yr (Tony?)
It seems to be related to having the Background layer switched on or off.
Workflow:
1 – rectangular marquee to select then CTRL+C
2 – File > New > OK from clipboard > Paste CTRL+V
This new file will have two layers a background layer appearing in white fill and the pasted image.
Translucency is restored if the background is switched off.
If the background layer is changed from White to Black and switched on then transluceny is lost. It seems to depend a bit on the extent of translucent patch as well.
In some cases translucency is lost and the image appears solid whether bkackground is filled with white or black
In other cases it appears that switching the backgowund on has a Multiply layer blending mode thickening the color applied and reducing translucent area.
How this started was an observation that applying CTRL+J on the layer with translucent bits had a multiply effect plus filled in the translucent gaps at the same time.
That was sorta OK but the downside is it introduces banding quite obviously.
Thanks for your input Yr.. (Tony?)
I’ll have a look around and see if I can replicate the effect on a smaller image (present one with a single layer weighs in at 6.64 MB)
I can confirm that all observations posted here were made at 100% zoom, with Normal layer blend option.
My kneejerk reaction is that something seems to be adding a Multiply effect
This new file will have two layers a background layer appearing in white fill and the pasted image.
What I’m telling you, is to first test by creating a new image with a transparent background. Ctrl-N set background to transparent, then paste.
With a white background, you can’t tell about translucency unless it’s less than say, 50% opacity. The absolute test of opacity (translucency, if you like), is to control click the layer, then go to the channels palette and create a new channel from the selection (button at the bottom of the palette). Then, go to that channel and inspect it.
Using the info palette, you can run your mouse over it – anything less than 100% white for white areas, and 100% black for black areas, means you have translucency pasted in that layer.
Remember that the soundest reasoning leads to the wrongest conclusions when the premises are false.
Peace,
Tony
Hi Tony – thanks for the follow up, it allows me to explain
Common workflow
‘a – rectangle marquee tool swooped over image
‘b – CTRL-C
Workflow 1
‘c – CTRL-N (use transparent background option)
‘d – CTRL-V
Workflow 2
‘e – CTRL-N (use white background option)
‘f – CTRL-V
gives rise to
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http://img409.imageshack.us/my.php?image=051012031yu.jpg>
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In image labelled 1 you can see the translucency in image labelled 2 the same selection! a Multiply layer effect seems to be happening
These are the from the same selection from the same source using marquee tool on 100% opacity, Normal layer blend at 100% zoom
This effect is really the side effect!
What I wanted to show before stumbling over this was that multiple stacked copies of the original layer from whence the copies are derived have indeed a Multiply effect. Colors are intensified and enriched, translucent areas are diminished (all good at the time) and banding is introduced (bad afterwards)
I don’t mind popping the original image to you or anyone really if it helps at all. It is replicable on this computer but I do have some beta stuff installed as well.
It sounds like you’re comparing apples to oranges.
If you paste the selection into an image with a transparent background and into another image with an opaque background, the overall transparency between the two new images won’t be the same. The colors will be different because they are blending with the color of the background layer.
Also, have you tried control+clicking the layer thumbnail to select the contents of the layer based on it’s transparency and pasting that into the new images?
Good points! What I expected though was the background color to show through where opacity is light (it seems the norm?)
For example, if I File > save As > JPEG I’d expect the translucent (0% opacity bits) to go towards white or whatever the background color was.
It still seems, forgive me if I am mistaken, that a layer blending operation is occuring
Hmmm – if this were an analogue audio file I’d guess that the gain was set to high at pre-amp stage introducing some aberrations at amplification.
Some sort of boosting seems to be on the go?
Well, I tried exactly what you did.
I created a new image. Painted a splotch and softly erased part of it to create some transparency in it. I then dragged out a rectangle and hit control+c to copy the selection (didn’t control+click on the thumbnail).
I then created new image number 1 with a transparent background and pasted it in. Transparency was exactly the same as in the original image.
Then, I created a second new image with white as the background and pasted it in this image. The transparency acted as you’d expect. It was the same as the original image except that where it was transparent or semi-transparent, white was showing through.
I couldn’t recreate what you’re observing. For me it worked just like you’d expect it to. I was using CS.
How about multiple copies of the same layer in a stack with layer blend mode on Normal?
Then move one of the layers to see what happens to translucent bits
I don’t understand what you’re getting at.
If you stack copies of the same layer with transparency on top of itself, the overall opacity will increase. This is normal.
It looks like you had a layer style applied in the image in your original post. Could this be the cause of your observations? Maybe the drop shadow is multiplying your colors.
Thanks for following this through Scott.
(drop shadow was applied after taking screenshots)
Having looked at it again I am learning a great deal about the finesse of placing a tick in the preserve transparency box.
There is a very good chance I could have done things better
Thanks for pointing me in the right direction
No problem.
You could also try Alt+clicking between the layers to create a clipping mask or group… or whatever it’s called now.
This would confine the display of the layer(s) above to the transparency of the bottom layer regardless of how many copies of the layer you make.
See if this works…
1. Create a new image.
2. Create a new layer and adjust transparency/opacity to suit.
3. Duplicate the layer.
4. Move the pointer to the line between the two layers. Hold the alt key and the pointer icon will change to a little black arrow with two overlapping circles. Click the line.
5. The second layer is now clipped to the transparency of the first layer.
6. Duplicate the second layer. By default it should also be clipped.
You should notice that the transparency will not change no matter how many copies of the layer you stack on there.
This sounds good to me Scott
The subtle differences between electing to preserve transparency or not was lost to me (I still have a great deal to learn)
It might be that your source layer has a blend mode other than ‘Normal’. Some blend modes, such as Luminance, can have "transparency" effect.
Thanks Jeremy – it’s a good observation for sure.
The only thing I can trace it down to is transparency.
Replicating the effect in smaller files is quite easy.
For some of these it depends upon "preserve transparency" – depending upon workflow there are quite a few of these options along with the nature of the background layer (white, black, transparent)
Keeping transparency at every option is helpful
