CS Text problem when using an action – overlapping characters

DR
Posted By
Danny_Raphael
Aug 27, 2004
Views
2033
Replies
30
Status
Closed
I’m posting this on behalf of a friend’s description on another forum. I’ve seen this problem several times, but have yet to see a definitive solution. Has one been discovered yet?

– – – – – –

Using Photoshop CS I am trying to make an action that inserts my signature, something like "© Frederic"

I built the action as follows:

– New action
– Choose Text tool, click on image, type text: "© …" – Click Commit text checkmark
– Stop Recording

While the action is being recorded, no problem. It adds the text layer with letters properly positioned.

When I open a new image and try the action, all the characters appear in the same position, stacked on top of one another.

See this example of letters on top of themselves when the action is applied: <http://fhoude34.free.fr/IP6G7514.jpg>

I tried the following to no avail:
* Different images
* Images with different resolution
* Different fonts
* Different font size
* Rasterizing the text layer

It’s also worthy of note that once the text layer is created I am not able to modify the text even though the layer has not been rasterized.

A successful workaround: Have someone record the action in PS7 and e-mail it to me. Same font. The PS7 create action works fine, but this is an unacceptable solution.

Is this a known problem or is there a solution for it?

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Y
YrbkMgr
Aug 27, 2004
Does this happen regardless of machine? I’m thinking of the issue of trying to reset preferences, but if it’s "pan machine", then it’s not applicable.

Barring that idea, have you tried to slow the action down from the actions palette? First you can try changing the playback options, and see if it makes a difference.

Another thing to try is to see if changing the text layer from point type to paragrah makes a difference, and also trying to start in paragraph mode v. point type.

These are all things that probably won’t make a difference but are worth trying from a troubleshooting perspective.

Finally, there’s a thread here about the type getting screwy. The fit and finish of it all is that someone else had a similar problem in as much as text wraps were getting funky. She had tried a hard return in the typing and was able to move on, but I’m beginning to wonder if there isn’t a text issue in CS, in certain conditions.

Peace,
Tony

Edit: If the image is saved, with the text layer in tact (but wrong), and re-opened, is it still funky?
DR
Danny_Raphael
Aug 27, 2004
Tony:

Thanks for the ideas… I’m doing "remote" troubleshooting (via e-mail), so I don’t have direct machine access.

Since it’s a one step (Text command) action, I hadn’t thought of messing with the playback options, but can’t help to hurt.

Point vs. paragraph mode is another possibility. Worth a look too.

I’ll keep you posted on what (if anything) works.

~Danny~
Y
YrbkMgr
Aug 27, 2004
I’m doing "remote" troubleshooting (via e-mail), so I don’t have direct machine access.

But can you replicate it on your machine? Or don’t you have CS?

I’ll keep you posted on what (if anything) works.

Thanks, you know I’m interested.

Peace,
Tony
DR
Danny_Raphael
Aug 27, 2004
PS7 is serving me well at the moment. I’m holding out for the CS upgrade (if one ever comes out – LOL) or by now whatver the new ver after CS. If product cycle schedule holds true to form, perhaps within the next 8-10 months or so.
PH
Photo_Help
Aug 27, 2004
Danny,

Did they every try resetting the preferences? I can’t replicate your problem in CS on my system.
Y
YrbkMgr
Aug 27, 2004
That’s what I was trying to get at in Post #1. Thanks Photo Help.
PH
Photo_Help
Aug 27, 2004
Tony,

I noticed that, but never saw a response. Sometimes things in the first post get overlooked and things end up way off track if you aren’t careful.

BTW, How have you been? I have been gone for quite a while. Hope I didn’t miss too much.

I had to come back to keep you out of trouble 🙂
Y
YrbkMgr
Aug 28, 2004
Thanks Photo. I’ve been gone a long while too, except the past couple of weeks. Good to see your expertise again!
DR
Danny_Raphael
Aug 28, 2004
Fred did some more debugging. He confirmed the following were tried (no luck with any of them): * Prefs reset
* Text tool presets reloaded
* Tracking = 0

BTW: He’s Win XP – SPack 1

When Text + Background file is saved and reopened, letters still remain (what appears) to be on top of each other.

Fred sent me a copy of his one line action as an .atn via e-mail. I loaded it in PS7 and tried to play it. Result: "Could not complete command because of a program error."

IMO something is whacked in CS, but it’s obsure cuz this problem only comes up once in awhile.

– – – – – – –

Photo Help:
If you would, send me an e-mail (via my profile – note you’ll need to ‘remove’ some text in the name) and I’ll FWD this CS-created .atn.

It would be interesting to see if it a) loads into your CS actions palette and if so (b) what results you get when you play it. (You’ll need a new image. The action was created using Arial font.

Thanks to both of you for jumping in.

~Danny~
PH
Photo_Help
Aug 28, 2004
Danny,

It will have to wait till Monday. I don’t have CS loaded at home. Monday I can try it on a computer with XP SP1 and CS.
Aug 28, 2004
Danny…

As there a particular reason that this copyright overlay is being done via text?

It would be a simple matter to convert the text to a custom shape, then apply and position it.

Perhaps at this point you’re now dialed in to the challenge of trying to figure out the whys and wherefores of the text problem in the action, but the final result could be produced using the custom shape.
Y
YrbkMgr
Aug 28, 2004
Phos,

I agree that there is a workaround to try, but this is pretty odd behavior for PSCS. If it were MY system, I’d be wanting to get to the bottom of it because this particular function isn’t all that I would use text for, if you catch my meaning.

Peace,
Tony
Aug 28, 2004
Yeah, Tony…I go into sleuth mode as well when a puzzle like this crops up.

I just wanted to suggest a way to accomplish the end task in the meantime.

Danny…I wonder if you might be able to add a "Reset Type Tool" step near the beginning of the action. Just shooting in the dark here…
DR
Danny_Raphael
Aug 28, 2004
Phos:

Tried the tool reset thing. In fact I stole that bit advice from a recent thread where you made that suggestion and passed it along to Fred. No go, but at least that eliminates a possible cure.

Your point is well taken from the perspective of finding a workaround. A custom shape (for batch) or a custom brush for 1-at-a-time manual application would work dandy.

It’s the principle of the thing: It ought to work! 🙂

FWIW I’ve these same symptoms reported 4-5 times now in various forums. Must only be a problem in a very small % of CS installations, else there would be more reports. Still, very puzzling.

Given not everyone on the planet is affected, there must be something unique about the environments of those affected. I’ve yet to collect enough environmental info, e.g, Windows version, service pack, etc., for a light to go on regarding, "What’s different for these folks?"

– – – – –

Photo Help:

Monday when you get a chance would be great. It will be interesting to see the results of your tests.

~Danny~
DR
Danny_Raphael
Aug 29, 2004
More info from Fred:

Appears problem is resolution related. That’s odd:

– – – – – – – – – –

Q: You get bad characters no matter what image you try, correct?

A: No I discovered the action works at some, but not all, resolutions: * Works at 300 ppi
* Works at 20 ppi
* Does not work ("stacked letters") at 72 ppi

Note that I never resample the image when I change the DPI.

– – – – – – – – – –

Does this ring any bells on possible cause?

~Danny~
DR
Danny_Raphael
Aug 31, 2004
And further information from Gary (a different user)…

Same symptoms under CS running under Mac OS 10.2.

What do you make of that?
Y
YrbkMgr
Aug 31, 2004
What do you make of that?

Well, it certainly sounds like it’s not a user error. It doesn’t happen at 20ppi, nor at 300ppi, but it only seems to happen at 72ppi. Reproducable on Mac.

Only thing I can think of, is a CS bug. But if that’s the case, why hasn’t it been reported more? There’s a post that may be related Here <http://www.adobeforums.com/cgi-bin/webx?128@@.3bb55da4>, but it’s not tied to an action.

If I got the gist of this one, it ONLY happens in an action.

I wish someone with CS would take a 72ppi image and try it. Danny, why not post the action on a site for someone to test? Then they could do their own action, and then test that one.

It’s odd though.

Peace,
Tony
PH
Photo_Help
Aug 31, 2004
Tony,

I am looking at it now. If it is ok with Danny I can post it for you to look at as well.
Y
YrbkMgr
Aug 31, 2004
I don’t have CS Photo Help, so it won’t do much good or I’d have asked Danny for me to take a look. Danny doesn’t have CS either, so we’re kinda blind <grin>.
Aug 31, 2004
Hey Danny…

How about posting a ZIPped copy of that Action somewhere we can grab it.
PH
Photo_Help
Aug 31, 2004
Phosphor,

I am comparing it now. If I make an action in CS myself it doesn’t have any problems. If I run the one Danny sent me the text overlapping problem occurs.
PC
Pierre_Courtejoie
Aug 31, 2004
Is the spacing of the text set to auto? (sorry, it should be "0")
Aug 31, 2004
See my edited post, directly above.
Y
YrbkMgr
Aug 31, 2004
If I make an action in CS myself it doesn’t have any problems. If I run the one Danny sent me the text overlapping problem occurs.

That’s exactly why I thought it a good idea to post the action. My thinking was that it had something to do with the action steps – maybe there’s an issue with the action being recorded in Percent or something like that…the only way to know is to look at the action steps.

This is good news though.

Peace,
Tony
PH
Photo_Help
Aug 31, 2004
Found it! 🙂

The point size is only 2.9

Change the point size to an acceptable # and the problem is solved.
Y
YrbkMgr
Aug 31, 2004
<golf clap> Great Job PH!
PH
Photo_Help
Aug 31, 2004
Thanks Tony.
DR
Danny_Raphael
Aug 31, 2004
Facinating, PH… You sure earned your stripes today! 🙂

More questions:
* How did you determine 2.9 pt was the culprit?
* Did you rerecord (double-click/edit) the Text step to correct it or delete it and replace with a new one?
PH
Photo_Help
Aug 31, 2004
Danny,

You sure earned your stripes today!

Thanks!

I knew that my recorded action worked fine at any resolution and that the one you sent to me did not. I simply did a side by side comparison of the two actions and found that there were very few differences. When I realized the point size was so small I guessed that it was the culprit. I then re-recorded the action using the 2.9 point text and was able to duplicate the problem.

The thing I found strange was that after you run the faulty action you can’t fix the text simply by changing the point size to a higher number. The only fix is to delete the defective step and redo it with a higher point size.
DR
Danny_Raphael
Sep 1, 2004
PH:

Very intersting. Your discovery prompted me to look at the action Fred sent to me (the one I forwarded to you). In Fred’s action the "Size =" field was blank (no value), where I expected to see "Size = (some value) points".

In PS7 I created a Text command-only action using font=Arial and size=2.9 pt. In the PS7-created Text command I could see "Size = 2.9 points" among the parameters and the action played w/o incident. I had to apply the action to a high-res image and zoom in a bunch to see the type, but it was sharp as a tack.

re: "The thing I found strange was that after you run the faulty action you can’t fix the text simply by changing the point size to a higher number.

You could be 100% right that the tiny font size was the ultimate culprit. I’m still a little suspicious because:
* The action created by Fred’s CS system causes a program error in PS7. That shouldn’t happen IMO. * The action was imported into your CS environment and exhibited the same symptoms. That makes sense because your CS executed the faulty command generated by Fred’s CS.
* You were unable to modify the command because it was faulty, preventing modification, hence the need for command delete and replacement.
* The problem crosses platforms (Windows XP, Windows 2000, Mac OS 10.2)

What’s curious is the action you recorded in CS using 2.9 pts exhibited the overlapping character behavior. Why 2.9 is bogus in CS and works in PS7 is another question for another day. I wonder if this is TrueType font vs. non-TrueType font war?

So, for the benefit of other poor souls who run into symtoms similar to these down the road, here’s aa summary of steps (more or less in least to most pain order) others have used that solved their problem. Your mileage will vary:
* Verify zoom value is 100% (View > Actual pixels)
* Delete the text step in the action and rerecord it with a different point size * Reset the Text tool (Phos suggestion… see: <http://tinyurl.com/3srhp)> * Close the Info palette (Dave Milbut suggestion… see: <http://tinyurl.com/52wm7)> * Ensure the Tracking value (Character palette) is legit (0 is default) * Reset Photoshop preferences (http://tinyurl.com/48oo8) * Verify video drivers are up-to-date
* Uninstall/reinstall CS (via a report from another forum… perhaps an overkill method of refreshing the Prefs file 🙂 )

Thanks to each of you for jumping in and especially you, Photo Help, for taking the time and putting forth the effort to troubleshoot. It’s been another facinating and educational experience.

~Danny~

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