This may be dumb, but I’d like to know

WD
Posted By
Walter Donavan
May 27, 2004
Views
513
Replies
14
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Closed
I find Levels a useful tool and would like to learn to use it better. E.g. I have an overly contrasty (burned out and dark) image I’d like to salvage. I do understand that dark and burned out areas with no detail can only be salvage by cloning.

QUESTION: I’d like to know what sort of rules of thumb (or eyeball) you all use to decide when the Levels of an image are the best they can be adjusted. My results tend to be a bit washed out.

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TD
The Doormouse
May 27, 2004
"Walter Donavan" wrote:

QUESTION: I’d like to know what sort of rules of thumb (or eyeball) you all use to decide when the Levels of an image are the best they can be adjusted. My results tend to be a bit washed out.

There is a book that discusses this issue. It is "professional Photoshop" by Dan Margulis.

The Doormouse


The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.
Y
Your-nice
May 27, 2004
can u send me a copy too please 🙂

"The Doormouse" wrote in message
"Walter Donavan" wrote:

QUESTION: I’d like to know what sort of rules of thumb (or eyeball) you all use to decide when the Levels of an image are the best they can be adjusted. My results tend to be a bit washed out.

There is a book that discusses this issue. It is "professional Photoshop" by Dan Margulis.

The Doormouse


The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.
TD
The Doormouse
May 27, 2004
"Your-Nice" wrote:

can u send me a copy too please 🙂

A copy of a $60 book?

Sure! I will tape it to the back of a cicada, point in the direction of your house and shout, "Fly! Minion! Fly!!".

Or maybe not.

The Doormouse


The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.
Y
Your-nice
May 27, 2004
just in case it does arrive thanks in advance 🙂

"The Doormouse" wrote in message
"Your-Nice" wrote:

can u send me a copy too please 🙂

A copy of a $60 book?

Sure! I will tape it to the back of a cicada, point in the direction of your house and shout, "Fly! Minion! Fly!!".

Or maybe not.

The Doormouse


The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.
BN
Bill Newton
May 27, 2004
"The Doormouse" wrote in message
"Your-Nice" wrote:

can u send me a copy too please 🙂

A copy of a $60 book?

Sure! I will tape it to the back of a cicada, point in the direction of your house and shout, "Fly! Minion! Fly!!".

Or maybe not.

The Doormouse

You bit! ……………..Sheeeeeeesh!

Bill Newton
TD
The Doormouse
May 28, 2004
"Bill Newton" wrote:

You bit! ……………..Sheeeeeeesh!

I always bite … if asked nicely. =)

The Doormouse


The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.
WD
Walter Donavan
May 28, 2004
Dear troops,

There are Borders and B&N stores nearby and I know the URL for Amazon. If I had wanted a book I would have asked for a title or found one on my own.

I wanted, as stated, in-the-trenches personal experiences. I’m an amateur and I am not asking for trade secrets. I wouldn’t know what to do with them if I got them.

Meanwhile, does anyone want to take a try at actually answering my question? Or is this group dedicated to not helping beginners?
TD
The Doormouse
May 28, 2004
"Walter Donavan" wrote:

Meanwhile, does anyone want to take a try at actually answering my question?

Your question has no correct, quick, easy answer.

The book that I mentioned devotes hundreds of pages to the topic, plus illustrations throughout.

If you want an incorrect, easy answer:

Use the histogram tool and color samplers alot – look for the blackest black point, and the brightest color spots.

The fastest answer:
Use "auto levels" and "auto contrast"

The Doormouse


The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.
FB
Frederic Banaszak
May 28, 2004
On Fri, 28 May 2004 14:43:21 GMT, The Doormouse
wrote:

The fastest answer:
Use "auto levels" and "auto contrast"

This, by far, is the best. Then the OP won’t have to think at all.
S
She
May 28, 2004
I use the levels on almost every picture I work on. Depending on what information the picture has in the histogram, I adjust. I will pull the middle out of a dark picture with the middle slider. Then I will usually bump up the contrast with brightness/contrast to take care of the washed out look it tends to give.

Depending on the picture, I will often click on the options in the levels and enhance monochromatic contrast to give it some ‘pop’.

I have learned that if pulling the middle out washes it out too much. I will leave it a bit dark and finish lightening the picture with the brightness slider on brightness/contrast. I will bump up the saturation as well if needed.

I guess my small bit of advice would be to use the brightness /contrast tool along with the levels. As well as master saturation.

Hope that helps. 🙂

"Walter Donavan" wrote in message
Dear troops,

There are Borders and B&N stores nearby and I know the URL for Amazon. If
I
had wanted a book I would have asked for a title or found one on my own.
I wanted, as stated, in-the-trenches personal experiences. I’m an amateur and I am not asking for trade secrets. I wouldn’t know what to do with
them
if I got them.

Meanwhile, does anyone want to take a try at actually answering my
question?
Or is this group dedicated to not helping beginners?

A7
aka 717
May 28, 2004
"Walter Donavan" wrote in message
I find Levels a useful tool and would like to learn to use it better. E.g.
I
have an overly contrasty (burned out and dark) image I’d like to salvage.
I
do understand that dark and burned out areas with no detail can only be salvage by cloning.

QUESTION: I’d like to know what sort of rules of thumb (or eyeball) you
all
use to decide when the Levels of an image are the best they can be
adjusted.
My results tend to be a bit washed out.

First I wonder why you continue to make the same
mistake, the washing out. Do you know how to add
contrast? Are you adjusting for print/ web/ to view on
your computer/ to view on a CD or DVD on TV? TVs
have more brightness than most computer screens.

Anyway, experiment and if can calibrate your monitor
to the output goal. Than means that your monitor screen looks like what the final product will be.

One thing I’ve learned is to always move the sliders
inward to the first significant amount of pixels. If the color information that you eliminate is significant then back off a little until the details are restored. I use the bottom sliders to adjust the output so that there is no pure white or pure black about 25 for the left and 225 for the right.

You know sometimes my wife will notice things that I
just am too close to, to notice. So I get opinions from people who haven’t been looking at the same photo
for an hour.

Good luck.
MR
Mike Russell
May 29, 2004
Walter Donavan wrote:
I find Levels a useful tool and would like to learn to use it better.
E.g. I have an overly contrasty (burned out and dark) image I’d like
to salvage. I do understand that dark and burned out areas with no detail can only be salvage by cloning.

QUESTION: I’d like to know what sort of rules of thumb (or eyeball) you all use to decide when the Levels of an image are the best they can be adjusted. My results tend to be a bit washed out.

Walter,

More than likely you are pushing the black and white triangles in just a bit too far. This gives you a snappy looking image, but as you mention, detail may be sacrificed in the highlights and shadows. Part of the problem is that levels is a relatively crude tool.

My advice is to skip levels and dig into curves. Curves give you much more control than levels

The demo version of Curvemeister includes several tutorials that deal with shadows and highlights, as well as some other concepts that help you to make your images better.
http://curvemeister.phoenixrising-web.net/downloads/cmdemo/

Mike Russell
www.curvemeister.com
www.geigy.2y.net
WD
Walter Donavan
May 29, 2004
Thanks, Mike, for the tips. I’ll also try the Curvemeister tutorials.


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C
customersupport
Jun 1, 2004
Mike Russell wrote:

Walter Donavan wrote:

I find Levels a useful tool and would like to learn to use it better.
E.g. I have an overly contrasty (burned out and dark) image I’d like
to salvage. I do understand that dark and burned out areas with no detail can only be salvage by cloning.

QUESTION: I’d like to know what sort of rules of thumb (or eyeball) you all use to decide when the Levels of an image are the best they can be adjusted. My results tend to be a bit washed out.

Walter,

More than likely you are pushing the black and white triangles in just a bit too far. This gives you a snappy looking image, but as you mention, detail may be sacrificed in the highlights and shadows. Part of the problem is that levels is a relatively crude tool.

My advice is to skip levels and dig into curves. Curves give you much more control than levels

The demo version of Curvemeister includes several tutorials that deal with shadows and highlights, as well as some other concepts that help you to make your images better.
http://curvemeister.phoenixrising-web.net/downloads/cmdemo/
Be careful with curves also. It has a tendancy to shift colors. When your values are set (Command or CTRL click on the area of your image you want to change in curves) change the adjustment layer blending mode to luminosity so that it only affects contrast and high light.

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